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I don't like Connor but I don't think he's stupid enough to fall for Cordelia's act, saying Angel was going to kill her out of jealousy/hatred for Connor.  Nor do i believe he would kill a girl.

This is right up there with the Magic!Crack story. And just like that story, one I wont watch again.

Edited by cleo

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On ‎11‎/‎01‎/‎2019 at 2:18 AM, cleo said:

I don't like Connor but I don't think he's stupid enough to fall for Cordelia's act, saying Angel was going to kill her out of jealousy/hatred for Connor.  Nor do i believe he would kill a girl.

This is right up there with the Magic!Crack story. And just like that story, one I wont watch again.

You've got to think about his background, he's been brainwashed by Holtz all his life and suddenly all Holtz has told him about Angel turning seems to come true?

 The Good; Great final confrontation and like the way that Spike is so possessive of his clipboard. Powerful performance from Wes who grows ever more deranged as he suspects Angel has betrayed them.

The Bad; ?

Best line; Connor; (eying Illyria) "Sorry, always had a thing for older women" Angel; (muttering) "They were supposed to fix that" Connor; "What?" Angel; "Nothing"

Jeez, how did they get away with that? Gunn has his heart ripped out on a daily basis.

Apocalypses: 5

Angel Clichés In disguise; 8

DB/JM get's his shirt off; 19,

Cheap Angel; 8

Fang Gang in bondage: Cordy: 5 Angel: 15 Wes: 8 Gunn; 8 Lorne; 6 Fred; 5 Spike; 6

Fang gang knocked out: Cordy: 15 Angel: 20 Wes: 10 Doyle; 1 Gunn; 4 Lorne; 8 Groo; 1 Connor; 1 Faith; 1 Fred; 7 Spike; 5

Kills; Angel kills at least 5 demons, Connor kills 2 Cordy: 5 vamps, 3 demons Angel; 48 vamps, 72 and 1/2 demons, 5 zombies, 12 humans, one werewolf and one cyborg Doyle; 1 vamp Wes; 16 demons+5 vamps, 5 zombies, 4 humans, 2 cyborgs Kate; 3 vamps Faith; 18 vamps, 6 demons, 3 humans. Gunn; 11 vamps+ 15 demons, 5 zombies, 1 human. Groo; 1 demon Fred; 3 vamps+ 14 demons, 5 zombies Connor; 16 vamps, 5 zombies, 4 demons, Jasmine Spike; 21 vamps, 12 demons+1 human+one parasite

Fang Gang go evil: Cordy: 3 Angel: 3 Gunn; 1 Wes; 1

Alternate Fang Gang; Cordy: 4 Angel: 12 Fred; 3 Wes; 1 Gunn; 2 Connor; 1 Lorne; 1

Characters killed: 2265

Recurring characters killed; 12

Total number of Angel Investigations; 5, Wes refers to them running out of people. Angel, Gunn, Lorne, Wes, Spike

Angel Investigations shot: Angel: 15 Wes; 2 Spike; 1

Packing heat; Wes; 13 Doyle; 1 Angel; 4 Gunn; 3 Fred; 5

Notches on Fang Gang bedpost: Cordy: 5 ?+Wilson/Hacksaw Beast+Phantom Dennis+Groo+Connor plus possibly the Beast Angel: 6; Buffy, Darla, The Transcending Furies, Eve Wes; 3 definite; Virginia, the bleached blonde and Lilah, 2 possible, Justine, Fred Gunn; 2 Fred and Gwen. Fred; 1 Gunn, 1 possible Wes Groo; 1Cordy Spike; 3-Buffy, Anya, Harmony

Kinky dinky: Spike refers to Illyria as a 'filthy harlot'. Connor fancies her, once again a thing for older women, a teenage boy's lust so powerful even magic can't change it. Illyria wants to keep Spike as her pet.

Captain Subtext; Marcus tells Angel he and Angel won't be having sex on the couch 'anytime soon'. But doesn't rule it out entirely? Angel's 'Do I look 500?' joke perhaps a comment on immortal Angel looking noticeably older. Check out the little look Illyria gives Harmony as she walks out of Wes' office. Hmmmm? Connor wonders if Sajhan wants to kiss him?

Know the face, different character; 7

Parking garages; 10,

Buffy characters on Angel; 17 Wetherby, Collins and Smith. Angel, Cordy, Oz, Spike, Buffy, Wes, Faith, Darla, Dru, The Master, Anne, Willow and Harmony. POSSIBLY The First Evil, Andrew.

What the fanficcers thought; . A few nice fics regarding what would happen is Connor and Dawn hitched up. What would the children of the son of 2 vampires and The Key be like?

Questions and observations; Never liked Connor but much like Riley in 'As You Were' he's much easier to accept in small doses. Anne Rice bashed. Good! Was it Cyrus Vail that made Sajhan incorporeal? What courage Gunn shows although you'd have liked to have heard what Marcus was going to offer him? You forget that Sajhan never met adult Connor so has no idea who he is. Does everyone now remember about Connor or just Illyria, Connor and Wes?

Marks out of 10; 8/10 here begins the rehabilitation of Connor for me frankly

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Its a kudos to Vincent Kartheiser that he manages two new characterizations of Connor (false memories and combined memories) as naturally and organically as he did his previous one in season 4.  Given how much he made weaselly Pete Campbell on Mad Men a compelling character that's no surprise. 

I am glad that the memory spell was lifted as I wouldn't want the series finished with it intact, though with Coredelia & Fred both dead and only so many episodes left, it sadly really doesn't get explored as much as it could have been. 

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1 hour ago, Joe Hellandback said:

Always had a thing for older women" Angel; (muttering) "They were supposed to fix that" Connor; "What?" Angel; "Nothing"

Lol loved that line too.

I do like Connor Lite more than I liked "real Conner". A shame that it took fake memories of a normal life to balance out all the crap and finally appreciate how much Angel loves him.

Hobestly I wish we had gotten a scene of a remorseful Wesley apologizing to Angel for fucking everything up TWICE. But no, he never apologizes for anything where that's concerned.

Edited by Spartan Girl

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4 hours ago, Joe Hellandback said:

Does everyone now remember about Connor or just Illyria, Connor and Wes?

I think it's just them, since I think Vail said something like "if I drop this, reality changes for everyone in the immediate area", so I think those outside the area (Gunn, Lorne, Willow & Faith (who have met Connor, so presumably have had their memories altered (again!)) would not be affected. After all,

Spoiler

Connor's "family" still seems to know who he is (he doesn't indicate differently when he & Angel meet up again in a later episode). It's not until the comics where Connor mentions their memories changing and them forgetting him (which might not be due to this, but due to Buffy & company destroying "the seed of magic" in an earlier comic).

Oh, and Joe, don't forget---since this is now a single thread, you have to include the episode at the beginning of your review (I think this one is Origin?).

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5 hours ago, Joe Hellandback said:

You've got to think about his background, he's been brainwashed by Holtz all his life and suddenly all Holtz has told him about Angel turning seems to come true?

Yeah maybe in regards to Angel. But kidnapping a girl and helping Cordelia kill her? Connor has fought evil his entire life. I'm pretty sure killing an innocent girl with a butchers knife or whatever Cordelia had would ping something inside him that something is not quite right. I feel like killing an innocent and in some ways becoming more like his father would be Connor's worst fear. 

Anyway the whole storyline fails for me on every level, from the time Connor comes back. It will take a long time for me to get to season 5, I'm very slow. 

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Time Bomb

The Good; Great performance from mad Wes and lovely scenes between him and Gunn making up

The Bad; In any show featuring time travel it's always a bit of a cheat to kill characters knowing you can just click your fingers and bring them back.

Best line; Marcus; "Curing cancer Mr Pryce?" Wes; "Wouldn't be cost effective. I'm sure we make a lot of money from cancer" Marcus; "True, the patent holder is a client"

Jeez, how did they get away with that? The Breathren want to feed their baby messiah consecrated urine and panda meat. I'm not sure which is worse?

Apocalypses: 5

Angel Clichés Subverting the Hollywood cliché; evil demon Fell Breathren all paternal (and rather camp?) about the coming baby. They also like organic cola.

In disguise; 8

DB/JM get's his shirt off; 19,

Cheap Angel; 8

Fang Gang in bondage: Cordy: 5 Angel: 15 Wes: 8 Gunn; 8 Lorne; 6 Fred; 5 Spike; 6

Fang gang knocked out: Cordy: 15 Angel: 20 Wes: 10 Doyle; 1 Gunn; 4 Lorne; 8 Groo; 1 Connor; 1 Faith; 1 Fred; 7 Spike; 5

Kills; Cordy: 5 vamps, 3 demons Angel; 48 vamps, 72 and 1/2 demons, 5 zombies, 12 humans, one werewolf and one cyborg Doyle; 1 vamp Wes; 16 demons+5 vamps, 5 zombies, 4 humans, 2 cyborgs Kate; 3 vamps Faith; 18 vamps, 6 demons, 3 humans. Gunn; 11 vamps+ 15 demons, 5 zombies, 1 human. Groo; 1 demon Fred; 3 vamps+ 14 demons, 5 zombies Connor; 16 vamps, 5 zombies, 4 demons, Jasmine Spike; 21 vamps, 12 demons+1 human+one parasite

Fang Gang go evil: Cordy: 3 Angel: 3 Gunn; 1 Wes; 1

Alternate Fang Gang; Cordy: 4 Angel: 12 Fred; 3 Wes; 1 Gunn; 2 Connor; 1 Lorne; 1

Characters killed: 2265

Recurring characters killed; everyone but then they come back 12

Total number of Angel Investigations; 5, Angel, Gunn, Lorne, Wes, Spike

Angel Investigations shot: Angel: 15 Wes; 2 Spike; 1

Packing heat; Wes; 13 Doyle; 1 Angel; 4 Gunn; 3 Fred; 5

Notches on Fang Gang bedpost: Cordy: 5 ?+Wilson/Hacksaw Beast+Phantom Dennis+Groo+Connor plus possibly the Beast Angel: 6; Buffy, Darla, The Transcending Furies, Eve Wes; 3 definite; Virginia, the bleached blonde and Lilah, 2 possible, Justine, Fred Gunn; 2 Fred and Gwen. Fred; 1 Gunn, 1 possible Wes Groo; 1Cordy Spike; 3-Buffy, Anya, Harmony

Kinky dinky: Gunn suggests they keep Illyria in a leash. Spike refers to 'Dear Penthouse'.

Captain Subtext; Illyria says that adaptation is compromise and Spike teases her about learning and the Internet. Again, we see why humans rule the world and demons don't.

Know the face, different character; 7

Parking garages; 10,

Guantanamo Bay; Suspicion of each other has started to pull AI apart, they don't trust each other anymore?

Buffy characters on Angel; 17 Wetherby, Collins and Smith. Angel, Cordy, Oz, Spike, Buffy, Wes, Faith, Darla, Dru, The Master, Anne, Willow and Harmony. POSSIBLY The First Evil, Andrew.

What the fanficcers thought; . Angel travelling in time used by many fanficcers to rescue characters from all sorts of trouble.

Questions and observations; Wes suggests they keep Illyria as an asset. Jamie Bergman of course is Mrs Boreanaz and a Playboy Playmate. Has she turned up in Bones yet? Anyone else worry that Wes is slowly becoming Illyria's high priest? Marcus suggests that Angel has gone from front runner in the earning stakes to back of the pack, a hint of Angel's history at the WB? When did the 1000 year war begin? Anyone else think that Illyria reminds you of Lady Gaga? Jim Jones was a religious cult leader who led his followers into mass suicide in the South American jungle.

Here Angel get's the idea for the story arc in the last few eps.

Marks out of 10; 7/10 I think the Illyria storyline drags on too long

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On ‎13‎/‎01‎/‎2019 at 1:04 PM, MerelyAFan said:

Its a kudos to Vincent Kartheiser that he manages two new characterizations of Connor (false memories and combined memories) as naturally and organically as he did his previous one in season 4.  Given how much he made weaselly Pete Campbell on Mad Men a compelling character that's no surprise. 

I am glad that the memory spell was lifted as I wouldn't want the series finished with it intact, though with Coredelia & Fred both dead and only so many episodes left, it sadly really doesn't get explored as much as it could have been. 

Never watched Mad Men although loved Christina Hendricks on Firefly. Yes, I'm glad they came clean too, it would be like never finding out where Dawn came from. 

On ‎13‎/‎01‎/‎2019 at 2:17 PM, Spartan Girl said:

Lol loved that line too.

I do like Connor Lite more than I liked "real Conner". A shame that it took fake memories of a normal life to balance out all the crap and finally appreciate how much Angel loves him.

Hobestly I wish we had gotten a scene of a remorseful Wesley apologizing to Angel for fucking everything up TWICE. But no, he never apologizes for anything where that's concerned.

 

I think there's plenty of apologising from everyone all around. I like Connor lite too, much like Riley he's better in smaller doses. 

On ‎13‎/‎01‎/‎2019 at 5:49 PM, illdoc said:

I think it's just them, since I think Vail said something like "if I drop this, reality changes for everyone in the immediate area", so I think those outside the area (Gunn, Lorne, Willow & Faith (who have met Connor, so presumably have had their memories altered (again!)) would not be affected. After all,

  Hide contents

Connor's "family" still seems to know who he is (he doesn't indicate differently when he & Angel meet up again in a later episode). It's not until the comics where Connor mentions their memories changing and them forgetting him (which might not be due to this, but due to Buffy & company destroying "the seed of magic" in an earlier comic).

Oh, and Joe, don't forget---since this is now a single thread, you have to include the episode at the beginning of your review (I think this one is Origin?).

Apologies, will do. 

On ‎13‎/‎01‎/‎2019 at 6:03 PM, cleo said:

Yeah maybe in regards to Angel. But kidnapping a girl and helping Cordelia kill her? Connor has fought evil his entire life. I'm pretty sure killing an innocent girl with a butchers knife or whatever Cordelia had would ping something inside him that something is not quite right. I feel like killing an innocent and in some ways becoming more like his father would be Connor's worst fear. 

Anyway the whole storyline fails for me on every level, from the time Connor comes back. It will take a long time for me to get to season 5, I'm very slow. 

Oh I can't watch that scene, every time Connor does something right (sticking it to the tourist vamps during permanent darkness etc) you cheer for him and then they reset the clock and he's a jerk again. 

Edited by Joe Hellandback · Reason: n

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The Girl in Question

The Good; Personally I think it's worth it just to see 50s Spike and Dru in their chic Fellini phase. Also stunning to see Amy Acker switch from Fred to Illyria and back in the blink of an eye. Love the slow-motion fight in the nightclub.

Best line; Ilona; "The gypsies are a filthy people and we shall talk of them no more!" (the line that stays with you from this ep)

Notches on Fang Gang bedpost: Angel describes himself as 'Seeing Nina' but denies she's his girlfriend. The Immortal of course is an eternal being who may or may not be evil, just as Buffy likes them. Spike says he knows he hasn't a shot with Buffy but still loves her. The bartender comments that the Immortal's girlfriends come and go. So this makes Buffy's track record; Buffy: 4 confirmed; Angel, Parker, Riley, Spike. 4 possible, Dracula+RJ+Shadowmen's demon and The Immortal(?) almost certain that Buffy and the Immortal have sex but we've never see it so unconfirmed, all we're told is that they snuggle. But then she's done that with Scott Hope, Owen and Jeffery.

Kinky dinky: Spike tells Angel to 'Wank off!' The Immortal seems to have enjoyed a threesome with Darla and Dru which the pair are reluctant to do with Spike and Angelus. The Immortal didn't hurt Darla until she asked him to and describes him as insatiable and their sex as really great fornication. Dru refers to playing 'Pony'. Angelus once again declares that nuns are 'his thing'. The bartender describes Buffy as a 'girl gone wild'. Spike thinks that sex makes a relationship if you do it enough (good thing he never tells Angel about him and Buffy getting to fifth base on the balcony at the Bronze!). Trish Burkle seems very fond of Wes. WR&H Rome CEO is a knockout. Literally, I think her amazing breasts would knock you out if you got too close (but what a way to be rendered unconscious!). She also seems like a past amour of The Immortal and considers their dealings 'most satisfactory'. Angel refers to The Immortal eating Buffy's cookie dough. Andrew appears to be going on a date with a pair of beautiful Italian girls, has he become a Casanova or.....?

Captain Subtext; ....are they his 'fag hags' to quote Will and Grace? Loads of Spike and Angel bonding despite Angel commenting it's not 'About us' and referring to themselves as 'Partners'. Angelus' threat to shove the henchmen's arrows 'slowly up their arses' is rife with not so subtle gay innuendo as is the use of the phrase 'had us tossed'. Dru and Darla enjoy a threesome with the Immortal and then like to bathe together. Dru likes Darla to hold her underwater? Spike calls the Immortal a ponce. When they're on the scooter Spike tells Angel not to hold so tight. The male demon admits he's in love with the Immortal.

What the fanficcers thought; . Lot's of fic where the Immortal saves everyone from every possible fate that has befallen them. Lot's more slashfic when we see him with Spike and Angelus and sometimes both at once. Also a lovely one where Dawn has The Talk with The Immortal just as Joyce had with Angel, telling him that if he loves Buffy he must let her go.

Missing scenes; Rumour has it that SMG was willing to appear in this ep but Joss declined as he thought that the ep should be about the Angel characters alone and she would steal the show. Also rumoured that the Immortal would be played by Freddie Prinze aka Mr SMG or Christian Slater meaning that Buffy had fulfilled her ambitions in the movie of graduate, go to Europe, marry Christian Slater and die. Then again maybe the Immortal is more of a Hugh Hefner/Errol Flynn sort of character and Buffy is just his latest Girl of the Immortal's Mansion? (RJ aside she always did have a thing for older men)

Questions and observations; We don't see Gunn in his suit again. Lorne seems to be drinking a lot, we hardly ever see him now without a glass in his hand. Did Wes never tell Fred's family what happened to her? So is this really Buffy? According to the comics this is actually a decoy she set up because she's actually in Scotland but maybe that's AFTER this episode? Surely Spike and Angel would be able to tell her by her scent alone? Sadly the last time we'll see Darla, Dru and Andrew. What does 'Ragazza' mean? The chase scene may be a homage to The Pink Panther. Spike refers to 'shemps' from the 3 stooges. Illyria appears to be developing human feelings. Personally I agree with Wes, as long as Illyria can always keep up the pretence it's kinder to the Burkles to have them think that Fred is still alive.

In a sense our last glimpse of Buffy, how nice that we see her happy, dancing and enjoying life as a young woman should. Cool in-joke on Kristine Sutherland who took most of season 4 off to house sit in Italy and let her daughter go to school there and learn Italian. Now Joyce's daughters do the same.

I think a lot of people dislike this ep as we see our cool heroes humiliated by the much cooler Immortal but I think it's great. Andrew says that Buffy loves both Angel and Spike which the comics bear out. Personally I think Buffy/human Angel with resouled/human Dru as the girl for Spike, Spike in all honesty knowing he's not the guy. You must remember that the Immortal is not the long term guy as he doesn't age and Buffy does, as the bartender and Andrew point out they can't be together for long.

Marks out of 10; 8/10

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This really isn't a fair criticism given they likely didn't know at the time they were making this episode that the series was going to be over, but the Spike/Angel/Immortal stuff feels such wasted time for these last few episodes. I understand the need for some levity given how grim the final story ends up being, but the wacky adventures in Europe just feels like it comes out of nowhere and doesn't amount to much. It also creates a bit of tonal problem given the emotionally heavy story of Illyria & Wes is contrasted with the A plot and thus we get an episode that can't decide what its going for. The series for Angel and this season for Spike demonstrated how both had grown beyond merely their love for Buffy and it was a character arc that didn't really need this episode to make that point. 

I might have liked it more if it had happened earlier in the season, but as is it feels like comedy fluff without much poignancy. 

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20 hours ago, MerelyAFan said:

This really isn't a fair criticism given they likely didn't know at the time they were making this episode that the series was going to be over, but the Spike/Angel/Immortal stuff feels such wasted time for these last few episodes. I understand the need for some levity given how grim the final story ends up being, but the wacky adventures in Europe just feels like it comes out of nowhere and doesn't amount to much. It also creates a bit of tonal problem given the emotionally heavy story of Illyria & Wes is contrasted with the A plot and thus we get an episode that can't decide what its going for. The series for Angel and this season for Spike demonstrated how both had grown beyond merely their love for Buffy and it was a character arc that didn't really need this episode to make that point. 

I might have liked it more if it had happened earlier in the season, but as is it feels like comedy fluff without much poignancy. 

No, they knew the series was ending immediately after the 100th ep (they actually let them have a party then told them the bad news).

 

The Good; Drogan and Illyria play Crash Bandicoot. Angel reveals his devious side and Illyria starts to embrace her humanity.

The Bad; When Angel arrives at WR&H's offices it's night but when he walks into his office it's day. Angel threatens Lorne with a neck hold but we know Lorne can be decapitated and survive? But maybe that's the point?

Best line; Lindsey; "They're a secret society" Gunn; "Never heard of them" Lindsey; "That's because they're SECRET!"

Jeez, how did they get away with that? Drogan tortured and killed is horrible. Also nasty to see Marcus pounding Illyria.

Apocalypses: 5

Angel Clichés Subverting the Hollywood cliché; Angel kills Drogan!

In disguise; 8

DB/JM get's his shirt off; 20

Cheap Angel; 8

Fang Gang in bondage: Cordy: 5 Angel: 15 Wes: 8 Gunn; 8 Lorne; 6 Fred; 5 Spike; 6

Fang gang knocked out: Cordy: 15 Angel: 20 Wes: 10 Doyle; 1 Gunn; 4 Lorne; 8 Groo; 1 Connor; 1 Faith; 1 Fred; 7 Spike; 5

Kills; Illyria kills the demon, Angel kills Drogan Cordy: 5 vamps, 3 demons Angel; 48 vamps, 72 and 1/2 demons, 5 zombies, 13 humans, one werewolf and one cyborg Doyle; 1 vamp Wes; 16 demons+5 vamps, 5 zombies, 4 humans, 2 cyborgs Kate; 3 vamps Faith; 18 vamps, 6 demons, 3 humans. Gunn; 11 vamps+ 15 demons, 5 zombies, 1 human. Groo; 1 demon Fred; 3 vamps+ 14 demons, 5 zombies Connor; 16 vamps, 5 zombies, 4 demons, Jasmine Spike; 21 vamps, 12 demons+1 human+one parasite

Fang Gang go evil: we almost think Angel does Cordy: 3 Angel: 3 Gunn; 1 Wes; 1

Alternate Fang Gang; Cordy: 4 Angel: 12 Fred; 3 Wes; 1 Gunn; 2 Connor; 1 Lorne; 1

Characters killed: 4 civilians plus Drogan 2269

Recurring characters killed; Drogan 13

Total number of Angel Investigations; 5, Illyria goes hunting with Spike, starting to become one of the gang Angel, Gunn, Lorne, Wes, Spike

Angel Investigations shot: Angel: 15 Wes; 2 Spike; 1

Packing heat; Wes confronts Angel with a shotgun but Angel takes it off him Wes; 14 Doyle; 1 Angel; 5 Gunn; 3 Fred; 5

Notches on the Scooby bedpost; Angel beds Nina, possibly the healthiest relationship he ever actually has? Cordy: 5 ?+Wilson/Hacksaw Beast+Phantom Dennis+Groo+Connor plus possibly the Beast Angel: 7; Buffy, Darla, The Transcending Furies, Eve, Nina Wes; 3 definite; Virginia, the bleached blonde and Lilah, 2 possible, Justine, Fred Gunn; 2 Fred and Gwen. Fred; 1 Gunn, 1 possible Wes Groo; 1Cordy Spike; 3-Buffy, Anya, Harmony

Kinky dinky: Nina rummages in her bedside drawer for her stake. She finds something similar in shape and size but declares 'That's not a stake'? (does it take batteries, perhaps?). She refers to Angel's Rome friend and worries he was thinking of her (another petite blonde with supernatural abilities). Angel has obviously rocked her world to judge by her remarks, she agrees with the Furies. Oddly she suggests that Angel makes love on the beach 'by himself'? Illyria states that she and Wes are no longer having intercourse which Spike misunderstands.

Captain Subtext; Spike empathises with Illyria and they develop quite a nice relationship so late in the day. Is the demonic female senator aiming to be president in 2008 a parody of Hilary Clinton? Angel refers to him and Spike being intimate once but he may be referring to the events of 'Just Rewards'. Spike refers to frat boys paddling each other's behinds to prove their manhood.

Know the face, different character; 7

Parking garages; 10,

Guantanamo Bay; Drogan tortures the demon assassin whilst Angel sacrifices him for the greater good. Angel says that Lorne was amoral in his running of Caritas, he has a point. The gang want to torture Lindsey again but don't have to.

Buffy characters on Angel; 17 Wetherby, Collins and Smith. Angel, Cordy, Oz, Spike, Buffy, Wes, Faith, Darla, Dru, The Master, Anne, Willow and Harmony. POSSIBLY The First Evil, Andrew.

Questions and observations; Stacey Travis who plays the Senator was in a great old low budget Brit sci-fi movie called Hardware along with a pre-Hamburger Hill/The Practice Dylan McDermmott. Did Marcus Hainsley install her in that body? Drogan is apparently over 1000 years old and linked to the Watcher's Council. According to the comics Nina does stay in LA for the apocalypse. Nina says that Angel is a bad liar but as events prove he's actually brilliant. Illyria wishes she was still in the Deeper Well. Marcus and Drogan are old acquaintances. Flashback to CC the last we'll see of her. Did you notice the Senator's election rival is Joss Whedon?

The Circle of the Black Thorn very Halloween 6. They're an obvious convenient story twist to give the series some closure in just a few eps but it's a fascinating invention. Do they represent the executive board of the WB? Does Marcus buy Angel's act or is he always suspicious?

Marks out of 10; 7/10

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The Good; The last day, (especially poignant for Lorne/Andy Hallet who sings a wonderful version of 'If I ruled the world'). The final battles, the twists in the tale. It's a small scene but love Harmony and Angel's little heart to heart, so very different but so very alike.

The Bad; Why didn't Joss do a commentary? Richard Burton is a Welsh actor, not English. Angel was human only 4 years ago which was more recently than Harmony was. Jeff Bell's right, the cloaks the Fell Breathren wear make them look like football players.

Best line; one of the best written shows on TV and they saved some of the finest until last;

Angel; (getting pounded by Marcus) "Kinda hoped the fight would be going a little better" followed by Connor (punching Marcus and sending him flying) "Care about that dress for less!"

then Marcus "I am a child of the Senior Partners, their strength flows through my veins, my blood is filled with their ancient power"

Angel (vamping out and biting him) "Can you guess the one word you shouldn't have mentioned?"

plus Eve; "Are you sure you can handle the Sharvin?"

Lindsey; "They're sending me out with karaoke boy, how dangerous can it be?" (oh the irony!)

Lorne; (shooting Lindsey) "I've heard you sing!"

and Angel; (as WR&H collapses) "Time to go!"

Eve; "Go WHERE?"

also where else on TV would you get the line, Angel "The Fell Breathren, I want the baby returned to its' mother and the foster family dismembered"

Subverting the Hollywood cliché; Lorne kills Lindsey, the clown becomes a tragic figure, much as in King Lear, his leaving incredibly poignant. We think Lindsey might actually be redeemed but instead he gets two in the chest.

Kills; In the course of 5 seasons AI kill over 300 beings and they're the good guys! Most violent show on TV by a long chalk! For exact figures see Angel FAQ

Recurring characters killed; Many made an incredible emotional journey's over the course of the show but when you think how Wes first appeared in 'Bad Girls' and how he dies here the contrast is INCREDIBLE! Yet totally believable, a tribute to both writers and actor. AI down to 4

And Lindsey? Ultimately Angel believes he's evil and Lorne agrees having heard him sing. I'm not sure if he's evil or just ruthlessly ambitious? If Angel hadn't taken over WR&H would he ever have come back to LA? Both he and Angel ignore the advice they gave each other at the end of Dead End and both pay for it.

People have pointed out that the only characters to feature in both the first and last eps of Angel;TS are Angel and Lindsey. But actually, excluding Buffy guest stars, the only regular or recurring characters to survive from the first season of the show to the end of the last episode are Angel, a dying Gunn and Kate who's off being a lesbian Assistant DA in New York.

Packing heat; Lorne kills Lindsey with a silenced pistol

Kinky dinky: Harmony and Hamilton get it on, Harmony gorgeous in her undies as Playboy fans can attest to. Wes wonders if he should spend his last day with Mistress Spanksalot, is she the person he referred to with the handcuffs in Over the Rainbow? Connor now thinks his fling with Cordelia 'Inappropriately erotic'. Lindsey comments that Eve is the one thing of his Angel never got his hands on, "Life of the Party'?

Captain Subtext; Illyria starts to show feelings for Wes and Gunn, maybe too late for both. Angel gives Marcus a hell of a hickey! When Angel boasts of his nice handwriting Connor replies "You girl!" Nice goodbyes between the gang. Angel tells Sebassis that if he wants to kill Spike then they may have to kiss. Angel tells Lindsey "I want you" but both decide he should rephrase. Illyria-as-Fred refers to Wes as 'My Wesley', just as Lilah calls him in 'Home'.

Guantanamo Bay; Angel and co discover that all the evil in the world is run by this secret society and decide to change things by slaughtering them all! Angel's killing Sebassis is particularly clever, a real Keyzer Soze moment.

Questions and observations; Angel turns the power of the senior partners against them, taking the power of Marcus' blood and using it to defeat him. Does this now mean that Angel is a child of the senior partners? What happens to Eve? Where does Lorne go? Connor goes from a dislikeable character in season 3/4 to actually likable here. So wonderful to see Anne again, lovely touch. So if Angel has signed away his destiny to become human does that mean it's definitely Spike? Is that why Marcus is now prepared to kill Angel? Are Illyria's tears all part of her Fred illusion or are they real and for Wes? Who are the producers Jeff Bell thanks but is not allowed to mention? Wes says the first lesson of being a Watcher is to separate truth from illusion. On TV there's a small thank you scene to the fans at the end of the ep but not on the DVDs.

Marks out of 10; need you ask? 10/10 Jeff Bell thanks us for watching the series. No Jeff, thank you and everyone else for making it. Angel and co are still out there slaying the dragon. And so should we be. C'mon everybody let's go to work!

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So I finally the next ep in my rewatch, Shiny Happy People. The relief- Cordelia and Connor are over, and with everyone bedazzled Connor is less annoying. Jasmine- it's a different take on a god after Glory, mildly interesting. I just reject the stuff about how she manouevered everyone from way back, so to me it just never happened, I can blot out this storyline lol. I find it offensive to think about how Cordelia/CC was treated. People rant about how awful Dawn and season 6 of Btvs is. This is how I feel about season 4 of angel. 

Every time I saw Angel in this striped yellow shirt it was a wtf moment lol. 

Edited by cleo

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I don't want to speak ill of the dead but Strega's Angel reviews on the now defunct Television Without Pity are absolute bullshit. They should have gotten someone else to recap the show who didn't absolutely loathe it's existence.

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