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thewhiteowl

S16. E10. What Child Is This?

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How DARE Jack tell the birth mom that the baby is better off without her just to east the guilt of giving up her own baby?? And what happened to birth mom? You got your $10,000, so no baby for you-bye!

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I am so not into kids so all the baby scenes were wasted on me...pretty boring episode considering some of the GREAT Christmas episodes of the past....The things I did like, Kasey's back story..and her interactions with Palmer are becoming my favorite part of the show. Palmer really has grown in the last couple of years.

The thing that shocked me was Gibbs almost romantically embracing Jack at the end..(kiss on the forehead too?). Not sure if the writers intended that kind of vibe from that scene but that's where I took it.

Overall, kinda meh...and the writers need new tricks as I knew the lawyer was in on something..as when Gibbs informed him of his client's death, there was no threat of lawsuit or even a question about a warrant to enter the guy's apartment..just a vibe of "oh too bad he's dead".

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I actually don't mind Jack telling a girl who had sold her baby the day before that she's not ready to be a mother.  Who knows what might happen a few months down the road when she's short on  money again.

I think the whole episode was ridiculous.  They should have handed over the baby to child services.  I'm not even sure I got their rationalization of not.  Even if they had found the mother, children's services would still have to have been involved.

I love McGee, but he is a terrible husband.  Your own children are more important. Your absence would not affect that baby at all.  I mean did he do anything of import, or even not of import, after he was supposed to have left?  I understand that not everybody can have Christmas off, but he had obviously been approved and scheduled the time off.  I'd be surprised if he knows his kids' names or could pick them out of a baby line up.

I did like the Kasie storyline. It rang very true and humanized her a bit.  

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2 hours ago, stonehaven said:

I am so not into kids so all the baby scenes were wasted on me...pretty boring episode considering some of the GREAT Christmas episodes of the past....The things I did like, Kasey's back story..and her interactions with Palmer are becoming my favorite part of the show. Palmer really has grown in the last couple of years.

That was my favorite part of the episode too. I miss Abby, but I'm liking Kasie too.

2 hours ago, stonehaven said:

The thing that shocked me was Gibbs almost romantically embracing Jack at the end..(kiss on the forehead too?). Not sure if the writers intended that kind of vibe from that scene but that's where I took it.

That's the same vibe I got too, but that's nothing compared to the incessant attempts to make us want Ellie and Nick to be the new Tony and Ziva. 

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Aw, I actually like Ellie and Nick together. I liked their conversations in this episode, I thought it showed a deepening connection between them and Ellie's not such a know-it-all. I get the feeling Gibbs thinks something is happening between them too, between him insisting they parent together to the way he watched them when they were taking the baby up to the house. I'm wondering if the mothership is gonna finally do office romance. It's so weird to me how they've avoided it on this show but embraced it on LA with Kenzie and Deeks. 

I'm really liking Kasie and Palmer's friendship. 

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I got a little misty when Gibbs hauled out his daughter's old cradle and the tree was decorated with the family decorations from years ago.  I am assuming he knows that Jack had a daughter whom she gave up for adoption.  I got the vibe that they were two people missing loved ones, trying to get through another Christmas.  Gibbs' softer side did show in this episode.  Harmon is very good at expressing emotions with little dialogue.

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The birth mother should be going to jail for SELILNG HER CHILD and her baby would be in the foster system, so why not send him directly to the adoptives that she had previously agreed to?  Jack's daughter seems to be perfectly happy and Jack seems to have loved her enough not to be selfish.

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2 hours ago, basiltherat said:

The birth mother should be going to jail for SELILNG HER CHILD and her baby would be in the foster system, so why not send him directly to the adoptives that she had previously agreed to?  Jack's daughter seems to be perfectly happy and Jack seems to have loved her enough not to be selfish.

They didn't know about the baby-selling until nearly the end and once a child enters the system, it's difficult to get them out again. There would also be no guarantee that the original adoptive parents would even get a look-in so I think keeping the baby away from social services was a good decision and the original adopters got the baby afterall so that was nice.

And why wouldn't the parents ask Nick and Ellie the baby's name? They'd be looking after him and they had to call him something so maybe that's what the parents were thinking.

If I was McGee's wife I'd be on board with him staying. Not just because a baby was involved but it would probably be less stressful to keep the in-laws separated. Even if they did get along, the spouse often still has to play referee. 

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I want Delilah back as a character. 

When she was introduced, I silently cheered because she was a strong, intelligent female character.  Then as her story developed, she became three dimensional in the best way and she made Tim a better character.

This year, her name has barely been mentioned.  Likewise Jimmy's wife.  

Could we ask for another TV series call it the Real House Wives of NCIS.  And have them acting doing real things, with only scant views of their spouses?

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Ugh, I hate when the writers do this. The NCIS team shows up at the suspect's apartment to question him. The suspect asks if they have a warrant and since they don't, he informs them he won't be answering their questions and tries to close the door. Gibbs just slams the door into the suspect's face, thus assaulting him, and then essentially breaks into the guy's apartment. Torres informs the suspect he will be searching his bedroom, which again would be totally illegal, so the suspect draws a gun and they shoot him dead with zero ramifications afterwards. Oh well, the guy was a scumbag so I guess NCIS was perfectly justified in using Gestapo tactics. Why didn't the writers do something like have the baby start crying when Gibbs was at the door? Then they could claim exigent circumstances for breaking into the guy's apartment. But nope, the writers are just too lazy to spend an extra ten minutes to think of a reason why a law enforcement agency could at least make a pretense of following the law.

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I have enjoyed the transformation from geeky Jimmy to competent and caring Dr. Palmer, Medical Examiner.  Dr. P was on top of his game dealing with Kacie.

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On ‎12‎/‎11‎/‎2018 at 10:10 PM, Katy M said:

...I love McGee, but he is a terrible husband.  Your own children are more important. Your absence would not affect that baby at all.  I mean did he do anything of import, or even not of import, after he was supposed to have left?  I understand that not everybody can have Christmas off, but he had obviously been approved and scheduled the time off.  I'd be surprised if he knows his kids' names or could pick them out of a baby line up.....

It is a real shame what the new producers have done with the McGee ghost family of Delilah and the twins since the passing of show runner Glasberg.  The writers come forward with a baby story that is not plausible for the most part while nothing ever happens with McGee to include his own family and any related responsibilities supporting a disabled wife especially during the holidays.  Instead, the viewers just get a lot of BS about McGee not missing work. I only continue to watch the show now for Palmer and Kasie.

Edited by VinceW
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8 hours ago, Rambler said:

Ugh, I hate when the writers do this. The NCIS team shows up at the suspect's apartment to question him. The suspect asks if they have a warrant and since they don't, he informs them he won't be answering their questions and tries to close the door. Gibbs just slams the door into the suspect's face, thus assaulting him, and then essentially breaks into the guy's apartment. Torres informs the suspect he will be searching his bedroom, which again would be totally illegal, so the suspect draws a gun and they shoot him dead with zero ramifications afterwards. Oh well, the guy was a scumbag so I guess NCIS was perfectly justified in using Gestapo tactics. Why didn't the writers do something like have the baby start crying when Gibbs was at the door? Then they could claim exigent circumstances for breaking into the guy's apartment. But nope, the writers are just too lazy to spend an extra ten minutes to think of a reason why a law enforcement agency could at least make a pretense of following the law.

That scene really pissed me off and soured me on the whole episode.  It was beyond bad writing.  And maybe it was because I was so irritated, I don't remember them ever proving "Vicious" murdered the guy--only that he had motive.   Cassie and Palmer were the only good things about the episode.

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12 hours ago, VinceW said:

It is a real shame what the new producers have done with the McGee ghost family of Delilah and the twins since the passing of show runner Glasberg.....

Well, at least they made some effort to get rid of Ellie's husband....they realized that he would be an unneeded "ghost" so they turned him into an instant scumbag.

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On 12/13/2018 at 8:12 AM, Notwisconsin said:

Well, at least they made some effort to get rid of Ellie's husband....they realized that he would be an unneeded "ghost" so they turned him into an instant scumbag.

Maybe Delilah and the twins are killed in a traffic accident when she drives the kids in a specially equipped van to visit her family. McGee can then take a cot at NCIS headquarters and he would never miss a case. The writers can just skip the excuses.

Edited by VinceW
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22 hours ago, Lizzing said:

That scene really pissed me off and soured me on the whole episode.  It was beyond bad writing.  And maybe it was because I was so irritated, I don't remember them ever proving "Vicious" murdered the guy--only that he had motive.   Cassie and Palmer were the only good things about the episode.

Didn't they find DNA on the victim that proved Vicious did it?

 

On ‎12‎/‎12‎/‎2018 at 4:14 PM, VinceW said:

It is a real shame what the new producers have done with the McGee ghost family of Delilah and the twins since the passing of show runner Glasberg.  The writers come forward with a baby story that is not plausible for the most part while nothing ever happens with McGee to include his own family and any related responsibilities supporting a disabled wife especially during the holidays.  Instead, the viewers just get a lot of BS about McGee not missing work. I only continue to watch the show now for Palmer and Kasie.

There were quite a few changes after Mr Glasberg died and it amazes me that the remaining writers can't continue what he started.  And yes I am still pissed off about Reeves!!!!  

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On 12/11/2018 at 9:17 PM, stonehaven said:

Palmer really has grown in the last couple of years.

He really seemed mature and compassionate, which I enjoy so much more than than the sniveling blabberer who's scared of Gibbs.

On 12/11/2018 at 9:17 PM, stonehaven said:

The thing that shocked me was Gibbs almost romantically embracing Jack at the end..(kiss on the forehead too?). Not sure if the writers intended that kind of vibe from that scene but that's where I took it.

I thought that with the kiss on the forehead, they were deliberately trying to harken back to last week's kiss of Kacie, and by mentioning the drinking and the way he put his arm around her, create a vibe that Jack is simply a female version of a pal.

On 12/11/2018 at 9:17 PM, stonehaven said:

Overall, kinda meh...and the writers need new tricks as I knew the lawyer was in on something..as when Gibbs informed him of his client's death, there was no threat of lawsuit or even a question about a warrant to enter the guy's apartment..just a vibe of "oh too bad he's dead".

I actually had thought that the lawyer was deliberately low-keying it with Gibbs and was then going to mention at the very end, something like, "Oh, by the way, you'll be receiving a subpoena for our lawsuit for unlawful entry."

On 12/11/2018 at 10:10 PM, Katy M said:

I actually don't mind Jack telling a girl who had sold her baby the day before that she's not ready to be a mother.  Who knows what might happen a few months down the road when she's short on  money again.

I would have been OK if that's all that Jack said, but she went beyond that and said something like "One thing you'll never regret is giving your daughter a chance for a better life."  That's an absurd over-statement.

And how much tragic back-story are they going to gradually reveal about Jack?

On 12/12/2018 at 1:49 PM, enoughcats said:

Could we ask for another TV series call it the Real House Wives of NCIS.  

I laughed out loud when I read this!

On 12/12/2018 at 2:34 PM, Rambler said:

Ugh, I hate when the writers do this. The NCIS team shows up at the suspect's apartment to question him. The suspect asks if they have a warrant and since they don't, he informs them he won't be answering their questions and tries to close the door. Gibbs just slams the door into the suspect's face, thus assaulting him, and then essentially breaks into the guy's apartment. Torres informs the suspect he will be searching his bedroom, which again would be totally illegal, so the suspect draws a gun and they shoot him dead with zero ramifications afterwards. Oh well, the guy was a scumbag so I guess NCIS was perfectly justified in using Gestapo tactics. Why didn't the writers do something like have the baby start crying when Gibbs was at the door? Then they could claim exigent circumstances for breaking into the guy's apartment. But nope, the writers are just too lazy to spend an extra ten minutes to think of a reason why a law enforcement agency could at least make a pretense of following the law.

Good summary, and this bothered me soooo much.  At the time, I kept wondering why it was transpiring the way it was, when it was blatantly illegal.

On 12/13/2018 at 9:49 PM, scorpio1031 said:

Didn't they find DNA on the victim that proved Vicious did it?  

I thought that I remembered thinking that none of what they were finding proved that Vicious did it, and that what they said about the DNA only proved that Vicious had contact with the victim.  I actually thought the whole time that the plot was going to revolve around their conclusion being incorrect, because what they had been saying was so weak in terms of "proof". 

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On 12/11/2018 at 11:31 PM, rhys said:

Why would the adoptive parents ask Ellie & Nick what the baby's name was?

I assumed it was because he wasn’t exactly a newborn and probably had a name already. 

On 12/12/2018 at 2:34 PM, Rambler said:

Ugh, I hate when the writers do this. The NCIS team shows up at the suspect's apartment to question him. The suspect asks if they have a warrant and since they don't, he informs them he won't be answering their questions and tries to close the door. Gibbs just slams the door into the suspect's face, thus assaulting him, and then essentially breaks into the guy's apartment. Torres informs the suspect he will be searching his bedroom, which again would be totally illegal, so the suspect draws a gun and they shoot him dead with zero ramifications afterwards. Oh well, the guy was a scumbag so I guess NCIS was perfectly justified in using Gestapo tactics. Why didn't the writers do something like have the baby start crying when Gibbs was at the door? Then they could claim exigent circumstances for breaking into the guy's apartment. But nope, the writers are just too lazy to spend an extra ten minutes to think of a reason why a law enforcement agency could at least make a pretense of following the law.

I agree w/all of this except for the gun part. He didn’t just draw a gun; he fired at an agent. That makes it a justifiable shooting. But yes, they shouldn’t have been in his apartment w/o a warrant or his permission (and not the permission he gave after they were already in).  But it’s Gibbs so 🤷🏻‍♀️.

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On 12/19/2018 at 12:01 AM, Tdoc72 said:

I assumed it was because he wasn’t exactly a newborn and probably had a name already. 

I agree w/all of this except for the gun part. He didn’t just draw a gun; he fired at an agent. That makes it a justifiable shooting. But yes, they shouldn’t have been in his apartment w/o a warrant or his permission (and not the permission he gave after they were already in).  But it’s Gibbs so 🤷🏻‍♀️.

I hate that about cop shows. I still remember an episode of Walker, Texas Ranger, with a very similar scenario--they bang on the guy's door, he refuses to let them in since they have no warrant and tries to close it, the ranger (not Walker) pushes his way in.

In real life, the crappiest defense attorney would get whatever evidence discovered thrown out because the cop didn't have a warrant nor the homeowners permission to search.

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