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SilverStormm

Good Witch

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I don't want to be Negative Nancy here but am I the only one who's thinking that this series is, well, boring?

It's very boring, being on Saturday is the only thing saving it, IMO

 

And what happened to NewBrandon & the other cop? Cassie mentioned Brandon once this episode, but we haven't seen any of the police people for 2 episodes now. They were an integral part of the movies/show before that, where did they go?

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I keep watching, but each episode gets worse. At first, I thought they were going to veer into soap opera land. Now I'm thinking the show would be better on the CW (no offense to viewers of that network).

 

Dear Hallmark,

 

Why did you have to mess with the Good Witch? A movie a year was great. A weekly? Not so much. And while I'm at it, Signed, Sealed and Delivered worked great as a weekly, and now you've relegated it to the occasional movie? If you screw up When Calls the Heart, I might have to break up with you. *frustrated sigh*

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I loved all of the Good Witch movies.  I totally understand that they were not able to get Chris Potter back for the series.  It upsets me, but I understand.  What I don't understand is why they have de-powered Cassie.  Now the only magic she has is knowing who's at the door before they knock.  Big deal.  I liked the Cassie who mixed up potions and had a knowing look when she realized what the big picture was and how she could ensure it happened.  

 

Some of the things that Abigail said actually made sense in a world with a wimpy Cassie.  That is not why I watch the show.  I watch it to see Cassie making sense.  

 

Did Cassie give Grace the compass just so she could step on it and have to see the dr next door?  I was hoping that it would have a little more guidance than causing a puncture wound.

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Dear Hallmark,

 

Why did you have to mess with the Good Witch? A movie a year was great. A weekly? Not so much. And while I'm at it, Signed, Sealed and Delivered worked great as a weekly, and now you've relegated it to the occasional movie? If you screw up When Calls the Heart, I might have to break up with you. *frustrated sigh*

But...but I watch Signed, Sealed and Delivered, I liked it as a series, why is it not a series anymore?

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Clearly this season is already filmed, or most of it is at any rate so any real changes would have to come next year, should the show be renewed. But this is just one site with unhappy/disappointed viewers, does anyone know how the ratings or reviews are elsewhere? Clearly Hallmark invested relatively heavily in this, they're promoting the heck out of it and have financial reasons to make the viewers happy.

 

I actually liked Catherine Bell's comment about how she wanted Cassie to be less perfect while maintaining her 'magic' quality. Sounds like a good idea, just detour the boredom and snail's pace of this thing. She also has a producing credit, which means she either has a salary bump-up hidden as her wearing a second hat or she's actually helping to steer the show's course. That's fine but as someone said (forgive me, I forget who) said when he learned that various actors--Mary Pickford, Douglas Fairbanks, Chaplin among others-- had founded United Artist Studio--'the inmates are running the asylum'.

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I actually liked Catherine Bell's comment about how she wanted Cassie to be less perfect while maintaining her 'magic' quality. 

But that's the problem, she has absolutely no "magic" quality at all. There was just a touch of it in the movies, but she's completely lost it in the series.

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But...but I watch Signed, Sealed and Delivered, I liked it as a series, why is it not a series anymore?

 

I just found about SSD last week when I was like "When is it coming back?!  It's been forever since the season ended" - I am SO DISAPPOINTED!  I loved that show!  I tweeted Hallmark Movies and Mysteries to ask when the heck we can expect the next movie (since apparently the christmas outing was the first one) but no response.  SO MAD! 

Sorry, I know that is a tangent to this forum.  I will say, for The Good Witch, I'm really enjoying it.  Not in a "OMG I cannot live until the next episode", but I watch it on Sunday mornings, and I always wish that it would just go on for four hours.  I find it very relaxing to watch, the time passes quickly for me.  

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It's so bizarre to me that Cassie isn't like "Just leave my house already, no one wants you here" -- she doesn't really come across as a mischievous imp, more as a really mean person.  I'm assuming she'll have to help Samantha (I think that's her name?) next week, or she'll be squarely in the 'bad person' category.  It appears that she's going to lecture her about backing off the good doctor, though. 

 

I said this in the thread for last week's episode, but I'll say it again here.  I find this show really relaxing to watch.  I wish each episode was even longer.  I honestly don't care if anything happens, it's just fulfilling my 'nice people in a small town' tv show needs now that hart of dixie has gone off the air. 

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I suspect that the character of Abigail is supposed to be the quasi bad guy or there to add some conflict or spice to the plots. IMO she doesn't really succeed because  (again , just IMO) the actress is either badly miscast or the role is badly written. She's neither fish nor fowl--is she there just to stir up trouble, help out in a round about way or simply has no place else to be? Granted it's early in the series but it seems to me that she hasn't found her niche at this point.

 

And I agree, if she were in my house I think I'd suggest she find other lodgings, away from my impressionable daughter.

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I suspect that the character of Abigail is supposed to be the quasi bad guy or there to add some conflict or spice to the plots.

She also seems to be the "magical" one, where is the magic? Cassie talking about herbs, or Grace being mysterious isn't feeling very magical.

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She also seems to be the "magical" one, where is the magic? Cassie talking about herbs, or Grace being mysterious isn't feeling very magical.

I agree. It seems that the producers are upping the playing it coy factor and it just doesn't seem to be working; it the magic real or not? When (not if) will Cassie hook up with the doctor? How (again, not if) will the drs wayward son straighten up and fly right? When will someone shove Martha under a bus? Playing games with the audience worked for Lost and X-Files, at least for a while until the audience got bored with being toyed with and all the red herrings but this show doesn't seem to have the viewer base to go along with that for season after season.

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Abigail knew that something was going to happen to Stephanie.  Grace knew that something had happened to Brandon.  Cassie knew that something was going to happen to one or both of the pregnant couple.  Is there a quota of only one "knowing" per person?  In the movies Cassie would have known all three things  I miss old Cassie.

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Ah, but Cassie also knew that the other two crises were delegated to Abigail and Grace.  In fact, when Abigail left to go back to The Bistro, she and Cassie exchanged a look.

 

I think her powers (and those of her relatives, Grace and Abigail) are expressed by asking questions and making statements, not by telling Stephanie you will have a hard fall on black ice, Brandon you will spin out and not have radio or cell service, guest couple (and Sam) the reason the father-to-be's hurting is physical, not just pre-baby jitters.  In fact the only one who paid attention to Cassie's warnings at all was Martha, and while she was over-the-top, it's nice to see how far she's come from the no-witch-in-my-town days.  You'd think people would pay attention when Cassie makes a warning.  These people have known her for nearly twenty years!

 

Catherine Disher is always always wonderful, and James McGowan as the out-of-town developer was a nice bonus (check out The Border on hulu - Disher plays a smart, experienced immigration cop and also bakes bribe-worthy cookies.

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Abigail is not a baddie in the classic sense of the word, like Cassie said she's got her own way of dealing with things. Everything's she's done has been a step towards her ultimate goal: put Cassie and Sam together. She got in the way of Sam and Stephanie, for example, delaying her while that dinner cooking session between Cassie and Sam bonded them. Right now she's working on standing in between Cassie and Ryan.

 

I said this in the thread for last week's episode, but I'll say it again here.  I find this show really relaxing to watch.  I wish each episode was even longer.  I honestly don't care if anything happens, it's just fulfilling my 'nice people in a small town' tv show needs now that hart of dixie has gone off the air. 

 

Me too. Even in this episode, the ominous tones weren't supposed to be bone chilling. I find it so relaxing I don't even feel the need to come here and discuss it, lol. I tend to watch on a Sunday and it utterly relaxes me. Every week I wish it was a 2 hour episode. Harks back to the 90s I feel.

Edited by Boundary
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Cassie and Sam deal with a severe medical emergency affecting one of Cassie's guests. Elsewhere, Grace worries about a possibly injured Brandon while she's stranded at the library with Nick and Anthony; and Abigail and Stephanie get better acquainted

 

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I have no idea what the point of any of the storylines is, what did they need a guy who needed emergency surgery? What was the point of everyone getting stuck in different places needing medical care? What was the reason for the whole snowstorm? I don't get it.

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It seemed to me that the point (such as it was) was to show the different 'witches' subtly steering the plots to where they could have a happy conclusion; Cassie ends up (sort of) making sure that the dr had whatever he needed to help the sick guy--though I did think that it was a cheat and dramatically dropped ball for the ambulance to arrive 5 seconds before they actually started surgery. Then Abigail sort of saves the lady barista and Brandon while hinting to bad back girl that she really wouldn't be ending up with new dr. Okay, no real point in having the daughter and her two suitors trapped, perfectly safely in the library. The scenes with Martha seemed mostly comedy relief attempts with some minor character development thrown inn--see, she really does care about the town beyond her own publicity. Oh, and we were reminded that Brandon's marriage is in trouble and he wants to patch things up with his AWOL wife.

 

I think the snow storm was an okay plot device but the same could likely have been achieved with, say, a big power failure or some such. A snow storm worked as well as anything, I guess, though I thought that it could have been milked for more effect; surgery in Gray House is more dramatic that a ride to the hospital, the kids could have been in serious trouble with no power, no heat, maybe no one knowing where they were holed up. Brandon could have been more seriously injured in the car crash, causing the witches to do something substantial to help and so on.

 

The episode was fine but I thought they missed a few chances for possible long range plots twists which could carry over and have interesting repercussions.

 

JMO, as they say.

Edited by Beden

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Ugh.  Super cheap CGI snow.

LOL, I forgot about that, it looked like someone overlayed "Frozen" over the show.

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Rather than the typical branded tchotchkes they're selling, I'd prefer to see some better quality merchandise that reflects Cassie's style in the movies. I'd love a replica of the necklace she wore for her wedding, for example. Or how about the kind of stuff she'd sell at Bell, Book and Candle? It also seems to me that the constraints of a series budget have not been kind to The Good Witch. Cassie's clothes, her shop, the Gray House interiors -- they all look less interesting, less exotic, more drab.

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I like The Good Witch enough that I'll even tolerate this dull offering, but they've really got to pick up the pace and actually find some kind of story to tell.

Jake's death should be a big deal, but the primary effect on Cassie has been to make her mopey and un-magical. But they can't do more than a lame memorial ceremony to remind us of Jake because they've got to draw out the unappealing drama over who Cassie will choose, the real estate pal or the new doc next door. Yawn. Neither of them are exactly sexy or even cuddly. I don't give a damn about their careers, ex-wives, obnoxious teen son problems or anything else.

This episode showcased all the problems of the show as I see it. Slow pacing, no real stakes, contrived (and not in a Good Witch way) circumstances. There's been a loss of charm, quirkiness and interesting people in favor of the usual pretty clone types. Where are her father-in-law and his wife? Add to it that I find Bailee Madison excruciatingly cloying and annoying. I wind up waiting for scenes with Martha Tinsdale, her husband ex-Mayor Tinsdale and Police Chief Derek. At least they're alive. (I love Noah Cappe. He shows up in odd places, hosting Carnival Eats or doing a cameo scene on Defiance.)

I'll continue watching, mostly in hope that they recapture the magic of the early movies.

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I'll continue watching, mostly in hope that they recapture the magic of the early movies.

I'll keep watching, too, but don't think the show will ever be like the movies. The movies (at least the first several) were written by Rod Spence. The series? Written by Sue Tenney, who wrote for Cedar Cove and 7th Heaven.

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This show is coma inducing, but I have it in the background when I'm cleaning or folding laundry. Not a single plot has moved forward these past few episodes.

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Jake's death should be a big deal, but the primary effect on Cassie has been to make her mopey and un-magical.

Thank you. I realize that Chris Potter is working on another job but it might help to elevate this snoozefest if we had some kind of flashback or dreams or reminisces about how he was supposedly killed beyond the vague 'he was shot in the line of duty and is a hero' stuff.

 

What happened? A robbery? Gang related? A drug bust in idyllic Middleton? How was Cassie informed? How about Brandon--his father's death supposedly led him to a life change into police work and may well have busted up his marriage. How was the daughter told, how was she affected?--my own father's father committed suicide when dad was 12--he never really got over it, no surprise and never, never talked about it; my brother and I didn't learn about it until we were in our 20's. This is a life altering event, not just a fly in your ointment. Aside from sadly mentioning how much they miss Jake, how about the old adage of 'show, don't tell'? Show us how much they're affected, how did it change their finances, was a fund set up by the town? That's certainly common enough, a scholarship fund for the surviving children, contact with other bereaved police families. Was there a murder trial? Aside from a ten minute ceremony and a plaque, how did the town respond? In most communities if a cop is killed it's a huge deal--as well it should be (my other grandfather was NYPD). The funeral would have been huge with likely hundreds of police from surrounding towns --from all over the state, in fact--attending.

 

I realize that the film for this season is likely already finished but, c'mon--a little meat would flesh out the cloying.

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When Middleton's enchanting "Good Witch" Cassie receives devastating news about the future of the Bell, Book and Candle, the whole town will come together to prove a little bit of magic goes a long way

 

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Was anyone surprised there was a happy ending? And no magic? What is the point of Abigail? Is she supposed to be the "magic"?, all she does is walk around & say mysterious things.

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This just seemed to me like a watered down version of one of the movies; various 'insurmountable' problems, all of which are resolved in a happy ending in the last ten minutes.

 

And, again in JMHO, a lot of possible avenues for a more interesting episode were missed. We never saw how other people in town might feel about a chain coffee shop coming in to spoil the town. Nice that Brandon and his wife worked things out so they both stay in town but how about any real life resentment regarding her ditching a doctorate from Cambridge and being able to spend a year or two overseas? Okay, so she probably enrolled in Middleton U but--seriously?  Cassie's advice was that marriage is compromise. Yes, of course but it looks like the wife made the sacrifice and Brandon gets to keep his job, home, family and it all went his way. I assumed, wrongly, that her big secret would be that she was pregnant for that happy ending. Oh well. Cassie is still sort of on the fence between her two suitors, though clearly leaning towards the doctor so this will be continued next season, I suppose. How about the guilt/complications of her making an actual choice and having the relationship(s) play out? The doctor's son decided to stay with dad and mom is moving to town? Okay, fine, so the writers have set up a tug of war between the parents and the boy gets to become a pawn between parents. Abigail? Some character definition would be nice--why's she there? What is her real agenda? Does she even have one or is she just filling time between jobs?

 

I don't know, maybe it's just me but it looks like the writers and producers are trying to walk a fine line between mystery, romance and happy endings and seem to be erring on the too safe and predictable side.

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Brandon put in his resignation with the police department to move to San Francisco because he thought that's where his wife was going to continue her education. He can join a police force in SF or in a small town outside SF. But what would he do in England? I don't know the procedures for getting work permits in another country, but I'm he sure he couldn't walk into the local police station in Cambridge and instantly have a job as a police officer there.

 

 

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A little while back, someone mentioned there should be a Cassie Nightengale collection. I guess she "heard" you -- hee!

 

http://www.thegoodwitchstore.com/

 

Rather than the typical branded tchotchkes they're selling, I'd prefer to see some better quality merchandise that reflects Cassie's style in the movies. I'd love a replica of the necklace she wore for her wedding, for example. Or how about the kind of stuff she'd sell at Bell, Book and Candle? It also seems to me that the constraints of a series budget have not been kind to The Good Witch. Cassie's clothes, her shop, the Gray House interiors -- they all look less interesting, less exotic, more drab.

Good lord, they're selling total shit.  And DVDs.

Seriously? She makes that much for just looking perplexed? 

http://www.tmz.com/2015/07/04/bailee-madison-good-witch-star-minor-contract/

30K per episode?  Good lord. That's got to be like 10% of the entire per episode budget.

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Being one of the top billed actors on a national network or cable series is a pretty good gig if you can get it.

 

As a point of comparison Angus T. Jones from 2.5 Men made $250,000 an episode before he left the show and this article from 5 years ago also lists some of the top Disney stars of the time.

 

Miley Cyrus: $15,000; Selena Gomez: $25,000; Each of  the Sprouse twins: $20,000.

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Being one of the top billed actors on a national network or cable series is a pretty good gig if you can get it.

 

As a point of comparison Angus T. Jones from 2.5 Men made $250,000 an episode before he left the show and this article from 5 years ago also lists some of the top Disney stars of the time.

 

Miley Cyrus: $15,000; Selena Gomez: $25,000; Each of  the Sprouse twins: $20,000.

 

{doing scale balancing things with my hands--try to imagine it}

 

{left side} Disney Channel --- Hallmark Channel {right side}

 

These things do not weigh nearly the same, even with some inflation figured in for 5 years passing.  30K on Hallmark Channel has got to be like 100K in Disney Money.

 

And CBS?  Fuggedaboutit.  Angus T. Jones had leverage that Bailee Madison (a late addition to her show's franchise) does not have. First, he was there from Day 1 of his show's franchise.  His character is even referenced in the show title. Secondly, I seem to recall they were cutting his character time back quite a lot, so even if he was bargaining for $250K per episode, that's not really the same as bargaining for $5.5 million per season (what he'd get at that rate for 22 episodes).  Because it was probably understood he'd be getting that 250K per for far less episodes.  And finally he had leverage because his costars probably had already bashed the shit out of CBS with negotiations and he rode their coattails to an extent. 

Edited by Kromm

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I think you're overestimating the Mouse a bit, Disney Channel churns out their shows as cheaply as possible. I suspect that Disney Channel pay is the one that is lighter than most other cable networks.

 

Bailee has been steadily working in Hollywood for years, film work, guest starring roles on TV, and a main cast role on a network sitcom. I don't know if "in demand" in the right term for her status as a young actress, but she wasn't an unknown without any options or negotiating leverage either.

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Yeah, but I think the Hallmark Channel doesn't need or depend on star power. At all. They generally go for old timers who used to have careers decades ago.  The primary component seems to be that it's people that will work cheap.


For the young cast members I think they tend to go for nobodies.  Soap opera and TV commercial kids.  It still doesn't make sense to me that they'd think they'd be getting any draw power from the name Bailee Madison, or that they'd even think they'd NEED to. Her lack of leverage isn't because Madison has no experience, but because the show literally doesn't need her.  If she's there and does a good job I'm sure they're happy, but she had to literally be approaching this from the position that she needed the job more than the job needed her.

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Yeah, but I think the Hallmark Channel doesn't need or depend on star power. At all. They generally go for old timers who used to have careers decades ago.  The primary component seems to be that it's people that will work cheap.

For the young cast members I think they tend to go for nobodies.  Soap opera and TV commercial kids.  It still doesn't make sense to me that they'd think they'd be getting any draw power from the name Bailee Madison, or that they'd even think they'd NEED to. Her lack of leverage isn't because Madison has no experience, but because the show literally doesn't need her.  If she's there and does a good job I'm sure they're happy, but she had to literally be approaching this from the position that she needed the job more than the job needed her.

 

Sure it would have been easy enough for them to cast a virtually unknown Canadian actress and pay her 1/4 of what they're paying Madison, have Brandon and Lori much more involved in the series and made it more of an ensemble show. I suspect that might have even appealed more to fans of the movies.

 

Instead they aged Grace up, made her (basically) the co-lead of the show, and cast a relatively high profile Hollywood actress in the role. Which indicates that they're trying to use Grace to appeal to young/teen viewers who aren't part of the normal Good Witch/Hallmark fanbase.

 

Which isn't to say that Bailee is a big star, but I do think she is as big of a young "star" as they could have possibly cast as a series regular on a Hallmark Channel series. She didn't need the role in the way a complete unknown actor would, and you could argue that locking in to a series on a cable network that's not exactly known for being young, hip, or raising the profile of its young stars was something of a risk for her. So her side was the one with leverage in salary negotiations.

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Guys, the bottom line for me is this: If Hallmark couldn't afford to pay Bailee 30k--meaning if it wasn't in the budget--they wouldn't be doing it. 

 

Is it weird that I don't think her salary's that high? Not for TV, anyways.

 

Interestingly enough, I don't have the Hallmark Channel. For those of you in Canada with a limited TV package, Good Witch is just starting on the W Network. I think the pilot aired last week.

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Guys, the bottom line for me is this: If Hallmark couldn't afford to pay Bailee 30k--meaning if it wasn't in the budget--they wouldn't be doing it. 

It's undeniable they have the money.  But saying it's clear they do doesn't explain WHY a particular actor is getting paid something (or how they negotiated it).

 

 

Is it weird that I don't think her salary's that high? Not for TV, anyways.

It isn't if you compare her to an actor on a hit show, no.  The main stars of The Big Bang Theory, for example, get around $1million per episode EACH now, for example, and it's only a half hour show.  

 

I've read that on broadcast networks a regular actor, but one who isn't the lead, can make $20,000 to $35,000 per episode easily. But those shows get at least ten times the viewership of Hallmark Channel even on their lesser rated shows--and so in theory a large multiplier on Ad revenues.

 

Undeniably she's getting the money. I guess that's all we really know for sure.

Edited by Kromm

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We're behind up here in Canada so this just wrapped up last night.  How more cliched could it get than to have her in the arms of her neighbour after brushing off the real estate agent?  I haven't watched the movies so have no idea how the son and his wife got into their circumstances but he should have gone to England with her.  At the very least they could have done something long distance for a little bit.

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Anyone know where I can find the "TINKLY PIANO MUSIC" names that were played throughout the show? Especially the piece playing at Cassie's speech in church! T_mack28@yahoo.com. Trying to get my niece something to learn on piano

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Did anyone watch the Halloween movie last night? I did not think it was that good. I could not get interested in the guy looking for the key. So many times I am waiting for Cassie to say something and she just kind of stands there staring. Lol. Maybe it is just me.

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The movies haven't been good for awhile but I keep coming back for the characters and familiar setting.

I've tried to give Sam (and his family) a chance but I'm bored. I think tptb should pair him with his Ex and find someone more lively for Cassie. Hopefully someone she can't read so easily.

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As with the show and the more recent movies, I feel like the writers start to generate some actual plot and tension, but then back down and keep everything fuzzy and non-threatening, which is a shame.  It is possible to tell a story that is comforting and pretty while still engaging and dramatic, but the writers seem to be holding back too much.  Add actual magic!  Add people who don't get along but aren't therefore good or evil!  Decide once and for all if Abigail (that her name?) is a bitchy foil for Cassie or a genuine ally with a different way of doing things!  Give Cassie a flaw or two!  Generate realistic happy endings, not total wish-fulfillment endings!  Allow conflicts to go beyond an episode or movie! 

 

There really is potential with this series; it's a shame we aren't getting it.

Edited by beadgirl
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