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S13.E10: You Can Look (But You'd Better Not Touch)

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Another stand-alone, one story episode? That's one way to save paying the cast $$$.   So Alex is doing what where?  A poor choice of an episode to air after the break when there is a cliff-hanger out there.

Edited by chitowngirl
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Wtf? What a stupid boring episode. I hated that blonde prego bitch patient.

Who comes back from a cliffhanger like that..lame!

And what is with how stupid the three grey drs were? They have been through a billion catastrophes you think they could handle a prison inmate. 

The judgement of the mom was ridiculous too. Like how long did they know the mom and daughter? 5 mins and they somehow know better.  Such a joke. This ep made me hate all the drs involved. Shut up Jo, Bailey, and Arizona!

Edited by Marley
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As a stand alone episode, I thought it was a really good story and the actresses were all great. I was trying to figure out where I recognized the prisoner girl from, and was surprised it is from Finding Carter. She played a very different character and I thought did a good job. 

But as the first episode back after a cliff hanger and a 2 month break? Huh?

Edited by KaveDweller
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I agree, I was skeptical at the beginning of the episode, but it turned into a good story.  

I feel like Greys did the same thing last year...coming back from the holiday break with a stand alone ep despite coming off a cliffhanger.  Anyone with a better memory than me recall that?  Maybe it's intentional to get the viewers back and settled before starting up again from the edge of the cliff.

Edited by pennben
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Jo is the worst. Telling her her mom didn't want to be there after she was specifically told not to?

Was I supposed to feel sorry for that brat who messed up her cushy, privileged life? Because I didn't. Grey's, you did the sympathetic prisoner ten times better in season two. I literally couldn't care less about her being in shackles after she committed whatever heinous crime she did, attacked the doctor, etc.

Lastly, it was a terrible return from a cliffhanger.

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Okay, Shonda straight up took the last voiceover from For Colored Girls Who Have Considered Suicide When the Rainbow is not Enuf. "A laying on of hands" is a part of the last scene in the play. I should know; I was in it. It felt like I was being hit in the head with anvils.

Edited by PepSinger
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Well that's an hour of my life I'll never get back.  I tuned to see what happens with Alex, and what I got was "feel so sorry for the violent felon who did something so bad that her mother, who from what we heard/saw was a decent person, no longer wants anything to do with her and understandably wants to keep a premature infant away from her volatile incarcerated mother".  I didn't care about the patient and I really hated how judgmental Arizona got with her mother without having the slightest idea what "mistake" the girl had made to be doing 20 to life in maximum security prison.

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Eh. I guess this was okay? It was a filler episode and we haven't seen the show since November, so I don't understand what the hell this filler episode was doing here as our first episode back.

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Yeah as a stand alone this was nicely done.  But seriously, I didn't want another bottle episode so soon after the last one.

I feel like

25 minutes ago, proserpina65 said:

didn't care about the patient and I really hated how judgmental Arizona got with her mother without having the slightest idea what "mistake" the girl had made to be doing 20 to life in maximum security prison.

So much this.  Arizona pissed me off.  She chose not to find out why the girl was in prison.  But the very fact that she was a minor in a maximum security prison is a big deal.  She wouldn't be there if she didn't do something heinous.  If the mother has issues with seeing her, then I trust the mother's perspective because she at least knows what the girl did.  Arizona is being judgemental with no facts. 

But Jo came in a close second.  She's awfully chatty when it comes to telling other people's business....

But I liked the prison doctor and especially the lawyer.

Edited by DearEvette
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52 minutes ago, KaveDweller said:

As a stand alone episode, I thought it was a really good story and the actresses were all great. I was trying to figure out where I recognized the prisoner girl from, and was surprised it is from Finding Carter. She played a very different character and I thought did a good job. 

But as the first episode back after a cliff hanger and a 2 month break? Huh?

I agree. I really enjoyed the episode. I think the guest actors were fantastic and are why I enjoyed it.

However, I do not agree at all with the judgment of the mom. Shut up, Jo. Shut up, Arizona. The inmate didn't make a simple mistake, she's in max security which means violent and likely murder or attempted murder. I did want to know what she did.

I recognized the lawyer but couldn't place her. Same with the Dr. Does anyone know?

Why do all these shows keep coming back for one or two episodes and then another long break?

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I made up the blonde chick's crime in my head since the doctors were too holier than thou to let themselves hear it. She killed everybody in her family - grandparents, father, siblings, and mom barely survived, or survived because she was out of town.

Yeah their holier than thou attitude with the mom was obnoxious.  Rich, pretty, little, blonde, 16-year-old girls don't go to maximum security prisons for 20 years to life for stealing MAC from Sephora.

Edited by RedVelvetWaffles
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1 minute ago, Court said:

I agree. I really enjoyed the episode. I think the guest actors were fantastic and are why I enjoyed it.

However, I do not agree at all with the judgment of the mom. Shut up, Jo. Shut up, Arizona. The inmate didn't make a simple mistake, she's in max security which means violent and likely murder or attempted murder. I did want to know what she did.

I wanted to know what she did too.

I feel like the mom looked like it was really hard to be making the choice she was making, and that she wasn't seeing the daughter because she didn't think she'd be able to do what was right for the baby if she saw her and got emotional. I can't imagine what it must have been like to be in her position. I did actually feel some sympathy for the girl, because even if she is a criminal, it must have really sucked to go through everything. But that doesn't mean she still doesn't have consequences for whatever she did. Or that the mom should be judged for her choices.

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"Mistakes" don't usually end with you serving 20 years to life in a maximum security prison.  I truly hated the judgmental tone they insisted on taking with the mom.  It was clear to me that she most likely killed someone or led to the death of someone, that is first degree murder type of sentence.

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I wish the mom would have yelled at Arizona or said something so Arizona could feel bad about what she said. I didn't want her to have the last word.

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So much this.  Arizona pissed me off.  She chose not to find out why the girl was in prison.  But the very fact that she was a minor in a maximum security prison is a big deal.  She wouldn't be there if she didn't do something heinous.  If the mother has issues with seeing her, then I trust the mother's perspective because she at least knows what the girl did.  Arizona is being judgemental with no facts. 

Right. The crime she did must have been truly unforgivable like maybe a family member because if she totally wrote off her daughter she wouldn't feel ashamed not seeing her and I think she's also scared of her. She really wants that baby to be saved. Even if Arizona's patient deserves some dignity and reasonable care, don't pretend that a person that young in an adult prison was charged because of DUI.

Also Jo really needs to be aware that every time she opens her mouth things happen whether she wanted it to happen that way. So I was annoyed that she was horrified by the Karev news. What did she think? She told him that if she reveals her identity her abusive husband might find her and she doesn't tell the truth she'll purger herself. She expected him not to react with that information? That was stupid.

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I'm torn about this episode, which I'm pretty certain I've said almost every episode this season.  

On one hand, I thought it was really well shot and acted, I like the different types of shots like the "security" footage.   I liked seeing Bailey, Arizona and Jo together (although Bailey was acting kind of strange to me in the beginning), and I admit to tearing up at the end after the baby was born.  But, it definitely an odd choice for the mid-season premiere.  I follow the spoilers closely so I knew exactly what we were going to see going into it, but still it felt odd and very non like Grey's.  They even played around with the episode numbers this year so this was definitely chosen as the premiere.  Yes, they did something similar last year but they had Denzel Washington to hype it up, plus while it was a "stand-alone" Meredith episode it still Grey-Sloan focused.  

Other thoughts, I liked Jo in this episode but was disappointed they didn't use it to reveal something useful and interesting about her history but rather have her tell the patient she robbed a store with an ex-boyfriend?  Seemed like they could have used that moment for something far more revealing about Jo.

Perhaps I was just getting bored/restless, but I didn't really understand the convo in the car at the end with Jo having to throw up.  I was actually just wondering if they wrote in something around Camilla's morning sickness because I didn't really get it.  I should probably go back and watch again.  

In a nutshell, its pretty much what I've to expect from Grey's....a fine, maybe even nice standalone episode but did nothing to advance any of the pending storylines.  

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This was a very good episode. It would have been a better episode had this not been the one after break, because i cared zero. craps. about. anything. because I kept wondering if they were going to intercut with you know - the good stuff. 

This show - severely, and utterly needs a social worker. Several. because I would like to think a social worker (representing the hospital) would have come with the Doctors, and then instead of Blonde Mom talking to someone who has zero. training. dealing. with. this, the Blonde Mom would have talked to the social worker. Then the social worker would have kept her damned mouth shut and let Kristen be examined and not have had to give birth early. What is with people telling everyone their business? And then being judgemental. And I think it was a severe copout by the writer (Was it Shonda?) not to tell us what was up with a minor who was in maximum security who is severing 20 to life. A 15 minute labour and a "I want my mommy," shouldn't ignore that this girl literally broke someone's hand because she was told she couldn't have another pregnancy snack. 

And sadly. On the scale of One to LVAD - this was only like around a 5. (we need to take credit for the judgement and shame shame shame). 

Jo is dumb. (What did she think Alex was going to do with that information). Bailey was dumb (why not tell Jo earlier?) 

Welcome back, Grey's. you annoy me. 

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Not a good bottle episode.  Co-sign on the unearned judgement from the doctors.  Seriously, those dimwits couldn't ask why this girl was serving a life sentence?  Oh, wait, Bailey doesn't want to know, so let's just ignore it.  Let's not forget that this kid basically vaulted over her bed to assault the prison doctor, and broke the woman's finger.  I wish Kristin had just owned up to her awfulness instead of having that stupid heart to heart stuff with Jo.  When the oh-so-sad song started playing during the birth (with the doctors wiping away tears, no less) it was just funny.  And manipulative.  They clearly wanted the sympathy of the audience so they avoided discussing the reason why she was in prison, and just focused on her feeling bad about herself and the baby's delivery.  

The only stuff I liked was Bailey getting a much needed lesson on the meager funding that prisons receive.  She's fortunate to work at Grey-Sloan, but there are plenty of places where they stretch everything they have, with no choice but to make it work.  I felt bad for that prison doctor.  Talk about unrewarding, and the choices she has to make on a daily basis would make anyone a cynic.  

Also, it would have been nice to expound on those prisoners who obviously needed some medical attention, since that poor prison doctor was stretched thin.  

Edited by Amethyst
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Not a good bottle episode.  Co-sign on the unearned judgement from the doctors.  Seriously, those dimwits couldn't ask why this girl was serving a life sentence?  Oh, wait, Bailey doesn't want to know that, so let's just ignore it.  Let's not forget that this kid basically vaulted over her bed to assault the prison doctor, and broke the woman's finger.

I think they didn't want to know because it would either horrify/terrify them they were in a room holding hands/removing restraints/sympathizing with someone in max prison. They didn't want to ruin what they felt for her. Sort of keep it untainted which is unfair to the mom, she knows what her daughter did and she's trying to hold onto whatever feelings she has for her daughter.

Yeah and even though the prison doc was kind of a hardass you can tell she's burned out emotionally trying to treat with little resources and then seen as the bad guy by the inmates no matter what. She deals with them 24/7 while no offense Bailey/Arizona/Jo just spent one day.

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1 hour ago, sking24450 said:

"Mistakes" don't usually end with you serving 20 years to life in a maximum security prison.  I truly hated the judgmental tone they insisted on taking with the mom.  It was clear to me that she most likely killed someone or led to the death of someone, that is first degree murder type of sentence.

Maybe she repeatedly stabbed her father in a brutal murder but it was because she snapped as he had been sexually assaulting her since she was a child. The mother never really believed her (or maybe she knew and is in denial...remember, she only went without makeup at the beach alone, and always wore pearls around her friends). 

On the other hand, maybe she stabbed her father because he didn't give her a car for graduation and the mom is right to want nothing to do with her. 

Who knows.....was Bailey right in her initial judgment of the daughter as a monster or was Arizona right in her final judgment of the mother as a monster?  Or, is real life not as simple as cleaving the monster growing in a womb from the good person or cleaving the monster that grew a good person from that person. Can they really be separated that easily.

I see what you were trying to do there show!!!  Which one is the good baby, which one is the tumor destroying the good one by overworking their heart?  

The point of the story was such that they made sure not to tell us what the daughter did to land in prison.  

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Yeah, I totally thought she was there for murdering her dad.

I liked it a lot more than I thought I would.  It even did a good job of shining a light on prison conditions without being overly preachy, as they're prone to be on this show.  It also served well to point out how dire Alex's situation will be if he goes to prison.

I was a little off-put by the episode making the prisoner overly sympathetic.  Like has been stated many times already, for her to end up where she is means she did something truly heinous.  By the way she had been acting all episode, I halfway expected her to break her daughter's neck when Jo handed her over.

Arizona mentioning how she didn't get to see her daughter pissed me off because it reminded me of the stupid custody agreement she thought was somehow a good idea. 

Edited by Starscream
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Well-produced -- narratively atypical, but written in the series' usual cadence. A better experiment than the usual standalones. 

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After a two-month break, we get this manipulative crap instead of the resolution to Alex's story? Screw you, Shonda!

The prison storyline left me absolutely cold. If a minor has been sentenced to 20 years to life in a maximum security prison, it means she did something truly atrocious and was tried as an adult. Not only that, she had to be isolated for the safety of the other inmates. And after she assaults her doctor and threatens to kill everyone else I'm supposed to feel sorry that she's not allowed to raise her baby? Nope.

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34 minutes ago, Starscream said:

I was a little off-put by the episode making the prisoner overly sympathetic.  Like has been stated many times already, for her to end up where she is means she did something truly heinous.  By the way she had been acting all episode, I halfway expected her to break her daughter's neck when Jo handed her over.

I'm glad I'm not the only person who thought this.  I'll join you in the sick, twisted mind corner for a drink.

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Didn't feel for the girl once, and I was very scared the baby was going to end up on the floor when they gave her to her, in some kind of, "If I can't have you, no one can," gesture. 

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7 minutes ago, LADreamr said:

Didn't feel for the girl once, and I was very scared the baby was going to end up on the floor when they gave her to her, in some kind of, "If I can't have you, no one can," gesture. 

Same here.  The moment they took the handcuffs off, I was afraid for that baby. 

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I definitely expected Kristen to hurt the baby or one of the doctors once her restraints were off because every single time they didn't do what she wanted, or tell her what she wanted to here, she immediately got violent and threatened someone.  A minor tried as an adult, and sentenced to 20 years to life, murdered at least one person.

I stopped watching Grey's regularly when they killed off Lexi and Mark.  I only watched this episode because I wanted to find out what happened to Alex.

It was nice seeing Arizona and Bailey, and the two actresses did a great job with a really lousy SL.

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If I had been that prison doctor, I would have told them why she was serving 20-life as a minor, whether they wanted to hear it or not. She doesn't get the luxury of not knowing. The mom doesn't get the luxury of not knowing, but those 3 privileged assholes pass judgement? Oh hell no! 

I'm with whoever said she killed everybody in the family but the mom. 

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I totally get wanting to show what prison conditions are like because criminals still deserve to be treated like humans. Even murderers should have access to healthcare and basic things like pads. Even prisoners like Kristin who clearly have anger issues and violent outbursts still deserve those things. But that doesn't mean you have to try to make me like characters like that. How much sympathy am I supposed to feel for her being handcuffed when I just saw her break a doctor's finger for not giving her another snack? And if the handcuffs were too tight during labor, why didn't they just loosen them one notch instead of removing them completely?

I guess Shonda wanted Arizona, Jo, and Bailey to come off as the wide-eyed naive Pipers of this episode, so incredulous at the inner workings of a prison, but it just ended up making them look like ignorant spoiled assholes. Yes, Bailey, OBVIOUSLY, the prison doctor is just frittering away all of her gauze, throwing it in the air like teenagers TPing someone's tree. JFC.

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As a mom of a 3 year old, and currently in ivf procedure this episode was very difficult to me. Can't watch problematic pregnancies, moms without babies etc...

I actually liked Arizona's last comment to Kristin's mom. Yes, she obviously killed someone, she is in maximum security prison - but the mom had no problem in raising her child. I found it a bit hypocriticall. You don't want to see your daughter, but you have no problem in raising her child. Which will always remind you of her

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9 minutes ago, Snow Fairy said:

I actually liked Arizona's last comment to Kristin's mom. Yes, she obviously killed someone, she is in maximum security prison - but the mom had no problem in raising her child. I found it a bit hypocriticall. You don't want to see your daughter, but you have no problem in raising her child. Which will always remind you of her

Her comment wasn't along those lines though - it was accusing her mom of abandoning her for making a "mistake." This is why I think they should have told why she was in there, even just at the end.  A pretty, blonde, affluent teen isn't going to be sentenced to 20 years to life for a minor violation.  If she, for example, killed a sibling in cold-blood, it makes the mom's position not only understandable, but extremely sympathetic.  But Arizona didn't want to know; she just wanted to judge.

38 minutes ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

I guess Shonda wanted Arizona, Jo, and Bailey to come off as the wide-eyed naive Pipers of this episode, so incredulous at the inner workings of a prison, but it just ended up making them look like ignorant spoiled assholes. Yes, Bailey, OBVIOUSLY, the prison doctor is just frittering away all of her gauze, throwing it in the air like teenagers TPing someone's tree. JFC.

Right?  "Oh, I should stockpile the extra?  I've been burning the extra at the end of each day. Thank you so much, Dr. Bailey. It's obvious to see how you became chief at your hospital!"

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10 hours ago, RedVelvetWaffles said:

I made up the blonde chick's crime in my head since the doctors were too holier than thou to let themselves hear it. She killed everybody in her family - grandparents, father, siblings, and mom barely survived, or survived because she was out of town.

Yeah their holier than thou attitude with the mom was obnoxious.  Rich, pretty, little, blonde, 16-year-old girls don't go to maximum security prisons for 20 years to life for stealing MAC from Sephora.

Besides which, if she's in a maximum security women's prison, she was tried as a adult, and based on my experience in Maryland's court system, a juvenile has to do something pretty heinous to get charged as a adult rather than a juvenile.

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But if I didn't want to see my killer daughter ever again, I wouldn't want to raise her child. That's what's for me messed up.

Too bad we didn't get the whole story

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1 hour ago, Snow Fairy said:

But if I didn't want to see my killer daughter ever again, I wouldn't want to raise her child. That's what's for me messed up.

Too bad we didn't get the whole story

Good luck on your IVF!  If we follow the theory that the girl killed her whole family except the mom, then the baby might represent parts of the family lost.

i recently came across a tumblr called "Grey's Head Canons" where people write a caption that COULD be true in Grey's world.  I found it amusing.  It's part wish-fulfillment, part fill-in-the-blanks.  Sounds like parts of this episode would be a perfect fit.

Edited by Scatterbrained

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Without all the "what ifs" and speculation about the nasty girl and why she was imprisoned, the episode totally sucked.  

After being off the air for two months, this is the best Rhimes could come up with. Very disappointed.

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I have no issue with the doctors not wanting to know what she did. They are supposed to do everything in the best interest of the patient and maybe they felt like if they knew what she had done, it might impact their feelings toward helping her.  Regardless of their feelings for her, they have to do their jobs so if ignorance makes that easier to do and makes it easier for them to empathize with the patient, which made eventually made her more cooperative, with i'm 100% on board with that decision. They had to do what was best for the baby which was to keep the mother out of distress. 

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2 hours ago, Veronica said:

If I had been that prison doctor, I would have told them why she was serving 20-life as a minor, whether they wanted to hear it or not. She doesn't get the luxury of not knowing. The mom doesn't get the luxury of not knowing, but those 3 privileged assholes pass judgement? Oh hell no! 

I'm with whoever said she killed everybody in the family but the mom. 

As long as they can do they their job without knowing, I don't think that they need to know.  That's not why they were there, they were there to offer medical assistance.  Obviously, they needed to know that she could be dangerous and needed to know things for their safety, but beyond that, it isn't their job to pass judgment one way or the other.  I realize that it isn't the same thing at all, but I work in a prison library and my job is to provide books and information to the inmates.  That's it.  I don't work with the more dangerous inmates, but I do work with those who need to be kept away from the general population for their own safety (mostly sex offenders),  I don't want to know what they did or why they are there, because that might needlessly interfere with what I am there to do, which is to be a librarian. Obviously, I think that what I provide is important, but it isn't anywhere near as necessary as medical care, and I would hate to think of someone not getting the care they needed because the doctors were horrified by their patient and having that effect their level of treatment, even subconsciously.

I thought this was a pretty good episode, but I agree that it wasn't great for the first episode back, especially considering all of the previews were about Alex's prison sentence.  However, I thought that this one was placed better than the one last year with Meredith getting attacked.  This one at least somehow connected to that main cliffhanger and was tangentially related to each of the characters in the episode.  Obviously, they were in a prison, which related to Alex and Jo sort of bonded to the patient and perhaps opened her eyes a bit to what Alex may be facing (even though as a former criminal she should have already known).  Bailey is facing all kinds of issues at her hospital but that can be put into perspective when she sees what other doctors and administrators have to put up with.  And the last scene with the mother may have struck something in Arizona, considering that Sophia is across the country, so she can't "watch her closely" or pay attention to her.  So while this episode didn't address all the cliffhangers and didn't necessarily further the current storylines, I think that it added some depth to what is already going on and at least it didn't start brand new storylines or wrap up old ones by having uninvolved characters mention stuff in passing like last year's winter premiere.

Anyway, I thought that all of the actresses did a great job and there were some really good character moments.  Bailey's prison fear was cracking me up and I thought it was kind of funny how the girl shot down Jo's attempt at orphan bonding!  And we found out that Jo knocked over a liquor store, if only she hadn't mentioned the car thing.  It must be a running joke for the writers at this point, because she added it on at the end when nothing else was working.   

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11 hours ago, pennben said:

Maybe she repeatedly stabbed her father in a brutal murder but it was because she snapped as he had been sexually assaulting her since she was a child. The mother never really believed her (or maybe she knew and is in denial...remember, she only went without makeup at the beach alone, and always wore pearls around her friends). 

Somehow I don't think it was that though.  If she had been sexually abused by her father I would think a good lawyer (which they certainly could have afforded) would have gotten her off due to self-defense or even insanity.  Or at the very least a lighter sentence.  This bitch was being treated like Charles Manson so I think it was something else.

Actually, I was hoping she would die so that the mother could raise the child in peace.  

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The patient treatment was over when the prison Dr asked if they wanted to know what she did. 

The more I think about it, the more it ticks me off that Jo opened her big mouth. Not only was it not her place, the lawyer specifically said do not give Kristin any information about the baby or any news that could upset her. She will become combative and violent.

Yet Jo did exactly that during the procedure which put the baby and everyone else in that room in danger. It almost played out like that caused the pre-term labor.

I have zero issue with the mom adopting the baby. I don't think it's hypocritical at all. The baby is innocent. 

Edited by Court
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As a Call the Midwife fan, I think Sister Evangelina could have delivered that baby and set things to rights with her rosary beads tied behind her back.

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16 minutes ago, Court said:

The more I think about it, the more it ticks me off that Jo opened her big mouth. Not only was it not her place, the lawyer specifically said do not give Kristin any information about the baby or any news that could upset her. She will become combative and violent.

Yet Jo did exactly that during the procedure which put the baby and everyone else in that room in danger. It almost played out like that caused the pre-term labor.

It seemed just the opposite to me.  I thought it played out like someone being honest with her was what finally calmed the patient down, even if it upset her.  It may have been somewhat reckless, but I thought Jo was putting the patient's needs first. 

Quote

As a Call the Midwife fan, I think Sister Evangelina could have delivered that baby and set things to rights with her rosary beads tied behind her back.

Sure, but Sister E wouldn't be trying to work through violent secret husbands, boyfriends going to jail for assault, possibly putting her mentor out to pasture and how to deal with a cute new frenemy love interest at work while doing it :)

I didn't mind the bubble episode as much as I did the placement of it.  I just don't know why they hype all of cliffhanger stuff up in previews and promos and pick up after a two month hiatus (coming pretty much on the heels of a 3 1/2 month hiatus) with an episode like this, which doesn't really address all that other stuff.  But its the second time in a row that they have done it, so they must have their reasons.  

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16 minutes ago, SPLAIN said:

Am I missing something here? Kail filed for divorce in December 2015. Javi deployed in January 2016, the same month Kail went to Miami to get her new "moomy make-over". What the hell difference does it make what he did overseas or what she did at that point? They were separated and a divorce was pending. I am with the poster who mentioned being old-fashioned and these two should have waited until the divorce was actually final, but if two people have agreed to divorce and papers are filed, IMO who the hell cares who banged who. 

I think you might have meant this for a different forum?

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Just now, deaja said:

I think you might have meant this for a different forum?

You are right. The page is acting wonky. I keep getting quote boxes and such as well. Thanks.

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