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Tara Ariano

S06.E04: Not Good Enough

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Did Adderall have scratches on scabs all over her legs?

I noticed a very fresh cut on the front of her leg when she was going full feral on the sofa. That's why I thought she'd fallen. Either that, or the cat had had enough of her shit.

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If Adam has been sober for 18 months, I'm the Queen of England. You all may call me "Dude, Your Majesty".

Ha! I was just coming here to ask everybody who thinks Adam is sober to raise their hand. Anybody? Anybody? Ok, then. In no way do I believe he is sober. Adam was practically cracking up just trying to get the words out. My guess is something along the lines of he's finishing his court mandated 100 AA meeting or whatever and only drinks beer now and doesn't drink anything for the 24 hours before his court mandated piss test (would 24 hours do it? I don't really know) and mostly just does a ton of steroids, but that's ok because he's a personal trainer now. Look I'm on the fence about if Adam is an alcoholic or just a sociopathic asshole and I pretty much never try and diagnose anyone else's drinking one way or the other, but there is no way that Adam could be paying attention to any sort of program and come out not knowing why people don't trust him. Right? They do go over that kind of thing in rehab, right? By the way I think Randy is spot on when he implied that Aubree may not have to actually spend much time at the center. The judge will use this as a way to whip Adam's parents into shape. If the judge doesn't think they are taking it seriously and Adam is given supervised visits, he won't show up. Aubree will have to go maybe 3 or 4 times before the judge just cuts Adam off for failing to keep to the schedule. If he fucks things up at the center his parents won't be able to cover for him.

I actually felt bad for Gracie. With Leah having no coping skills, Addie being a baby, and Ali having special needs, I bet Gracie gets put in the mother's little helper role. I bet the only time she gets attention at home is when she's in trouble or Leah needs her to do something.

Kalie, Javie, Joe, and Vee are all boring and awful.

Barbara and Janelle...jeez. Baba I feel for you, but shit. Janelle really didn't fall far from the tree. Jace was trying so hard to show Barbara all his stuff, but she would not be distracted from passive-aggressing all over Janelle! Yes, Janelle and Nathan are the worst people ever, but every now and then I am reminded of how Janelle ended up he own special brand of fucked up. Barbara really can not have a conversation that isn't negative. As much as I feel for her, she kind of drives me up the wall. I did crack up when she looked down at Kieser and said "oh he's big" like she was talking about a new dog. These people...

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Winners of the episode:

 

Corey: I'll show you on the calendar so you can understand.

 

And

 

Jace: Mom, I mean MeMe

Barbs (in front of Jenelle): You can call me what you want.

 

I think Chelsea with Cole is adorable, and I like the mention of him being shy about the cameras. And I thought the conversation about the visitation facility was pretty realistic. While Chelsea should have pressed harder earlier, part of it is that there was a custody arrangement, and for whether it was followed at first is unknown, but as time went on it became more obvious that the parents were letting Adam have Aubree alone, and then there was some fight mentioned about it. You can't just say "Judge, I think he's not following the custody order," and then the Judge takes away custody. 

 

Kail is so argumentative. Part of it is her terrible childhood, but man she needs to learn when to quit. She's still young so hopefully she can have some self reflection and grow from this.

 

Leah is hopeless until she admits she has a problem. 

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That's what gets me about Barb and Jenelle. Barb, bless her, is raising Jace. That is indisputable. Barb deserves all the accolades for taking that boy and providing him a stable, loving home. I am not faulting Barb for making the hard decision to raise Jace at her age.

Jenelle is a diagnosed bipolar addict. This is also indisputable, we saw the episodes dealing with this.

I just wish Barb and Jenelle would maybe go to family counseling in order to learn how to better communicate with one another. I believe that as soon as they start ramping up against each other, all rational though flies out the window. If they would *both* listen and think before reacting, that sweet little boy would be in a better environment altogether, and perhaps Jenelle and Barb could become closer.

I grew up with parents like Barb (both of them!) and even now, I never feel respected, and it has taken a lot of counseling to learn how to better deal with them. In my 20s though? I would yell and holler and keep right up with them.

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Nathan could try and manipulate someone but his main weapon appears to be shouting and name calling and talking over someone so they can't get a word in edgewise and Nathan can feel like he "won"

I think Nathan is just as manipulating. One recent example being the scene where he was late getting into the car with Jenelle on their way to the lawyer's office. He was doing that on purpose. Why? Probably for some argument Jenelle and he had earlier in the day or the day before or something recent.  He knows damn well Jenelle won't leave without him and he knew she would turn right around and follow him back into the house. That is how Jenelle and Nathan work.  Assholes like Nathan, Jenelle, and Adam don't do things like this unless they are getting something out of it. Nathan does what he does because he knows it will get under Jenelle's skin. He thrives on it and gets sick pleasure out of doing that to her. It's payback time! I could care less since Jenelle also does the same thing to Barb. I get pleasure out of watching Nathan sticking it to Jenelle. She is now getting what she has been dishing out for years to her mother. What I hate is, Barb and the kids being caught up in that sick, sad behavior.

 

There are other examples of Nathan being a manipulative dick, such as him telling Jenelle she needs to get custody of Jace. He is doing that to cut Barb out of the picture.

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I actually felt bad for Gracie. With Leah having no coping skills, Addie being a baby, and Ali having special needs, I bet Gracie gets put in the mother's little helper role. I bet the only time she gets attention at home is when she's in trouble or Leah needs her to do something.

 

I don't think that's true.  Last season, which I am watching now, after having to leave Gracie behind for all the adults to go to Ali's appointment, Leah promised to take her out alone because she doesn't want her to feel left out, and she did.  She took her for a girlie beauty day and it was really cute.  Also, in the outing in the messy car they were on their way to cheerleading, that is something that ONLY Gracie does.  I think all of the adults try to give her attention to show that she is just as loved as the twin with special needs and the actual baby, but my guess is that even with all their efforts she still gets a bit less AND I think she just may be a little bad, get into everything type by nature. 

Edited by Timetoread
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I think Nathan is just as manipulating. One recent example being the scene where he was late getting into the car with Jenelle on their way to the lawyer's office. He was doing that on purpose. Why? Probably for some argument Jenelle and he had earlier in the day or the day before or something recent.  He knows damn well Jenelle won't leave without him and he knew she would turn right around and follow him back into the house. That is how Jenelle and Nathan work.  Assholes like Nathan, Jenelle, and Adam don't do things like this unless they are getting something out of it. Nathan does what he does because he knows it will get under Jenelle's skin. He thrives on it and gets sick pleasure out of doing that to her. It's payback time! I could care less since Jenelle also does the same thing to Barb. I get pleasure out of watching Nathan sticking it to Jenelle. She is now getting what she has been dishing out for years to her mother. What I hate is, Barb and the kids being caught up in that sick, sad behavior.

 

There are other examples of Nathan being a manipulative dick, such as him telling Jenelle she needs to get custody of Jace. He is doing that to cut Barb out of the picture.

 

 

Such as "treating" Jenelle to an island vacation to propose and inviting HIS friend, HIS brother with spouses and charging the whole affair to Jenelle.  THAT was what the fight that broke out was about.  That was also the reason he and Barb fell out the first time, Barbara feels that Nathan is using Jenelle for her money.  She's right, he is.

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Kailyn has given up on her marriage. She doesn't use any of the tools because she doesn't care and being right is more important to her than being happy. And she tried to say "I don't want to spend all the time with you because we did that in the first 6 months."  That, my friend, is false advertising. It's sort of like "yeah, I'm DTF every day for 3 hours" and then after you get married you're like "nah."  Yes, people change, but you don't automatically want to spend LESS time with someone once you get married and get their benefits.

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Jo definitely traded up with Vee. It's such a sharp contrast to see Vee and Jo interact vs Javi and Kail. Kail is so hostile toward him. of course she is angry that he's not stationed in some other country so she can run around with her friends and collect his benefits. Who is the hell has a young baby and husband at home and runs off with her friends every weekend? Time to grow up honey.

 

I think this is a major problem with a lot of the teen moms. All their friends are still going out, partying every weekend, and they want to be part of that. Too bad. You made your bed. I wouldn't begrudge her an occasional girls night, but EVERY weekend she wants to be with her friends and not Javi? That does not bode well for the marriage. Also, why don't her friends and Javi's friends all get together? Then you could kill two birds with one stone. Makes me think Kail really doesn't want him around. 

 

If Adam has been sober for 18 months, I'm the Queen of England. You all may call me "Dude, Your Majesty".

 

I would, but my feelings for you have dropped. 

 

I am not against Corey, I am saying that Leah needs help.  I agree that Cory started out offering nicely but when Leah blew up he got a lawyer, asked for 50% custody and orderd a drug test.  Leah, who is not particularly smart and, IMO, suffering from something mental would of course feel that this was an attack to prove her incompetent.  The irony is that this is a sad vicious cycle (kind of like cops btw)  - she needs help but is scared to accept help from available sources out of fear that the admission of need will be used against her.  I checked the news and indeed BOTH fathers want full custody of their kids now.  For a girl who feels that her only worth is as a mother, being childless will surely kill her.  I know everybody here hates her but I don't hate her.  That is not excusing what she does wrong, but just understanding how wrong can happen in someone who is sinking to rock bottom.  I feel sorry for her.  I know that's not allowed anymore, but there it is.  Sue me.

 

You might be right that Leah needs some real help....but, to be quite blunt, Cory's main priority is making sure his girls get help. If my daughters were late to school every other day, making their own breakfasts, and I highly suspected my ex was using, you can be sure I'd be trying to get custody as well. I'm sorry if Leah has problems she cannot handle, but those babies come first. 

 

I feel like Leah needs real help. If she has chronic migraines that knock her out (which are legit awful if you're also vomiting), she seriously needs help. I don't understand why she can't have someone come help her take the kids to school in the morning? If she is really struggling in the mornings, it seems like a good solution to have either one of the grandparents or a babysitter (or switch off between) with a key come in and get the girlses ready for the day, feed them and take them to school.

 

Leah has had more help more times than I can count. She has her folks, Cory's folks, Germy's folks, crazy Grandma Sandy and nutty sister Oreo, not to mention a legion of friends who seem willing to help. We've SEEN her employ a babysitter when she wants to go get drinks with her sister, so she could ostensibly get someone to help her in the mornings if she really needs to. I don't think it's an issue of Leah not having enough help. She probably doesn't want people around when she knows it will be clear she's messed up. Also, homegirl LOVES playing the martyr. I also do not believe her chronic migraine BS as we've never heard about it until now. 

 

"Because diamonds are a girls best friend."  Why did that sound so fucking creepy?  That house is full of 'best friends' for Jace and Kaiser.  They think they can buy the kids love with toys.

 

Every week there's some new damn toy in that house! I swear they're more for Jenelle than Jace. Queen of getting bored wouldn't be able to cope, playing with her sons, if they had the same old shit week after week. 

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Jenelle: Stop using Jace as a pawn. You don’t give a shit about him, and we all know it.  Babs is the person who  stopped her life, to step up and raise him. Why would she congratulate you on being engaged to  a drug addict, with rage, who doesn’t care for the daughter that he has? Jenelle will never learn. Of course Jace is going to call Babs Mom. She is the only caregiver he’s ever known. Jenelle stopped being a mom when Jace was a newborn. She thinks that things are magically going to go her way. She manipulates Jace. My heart aches for him. Also, why does she have that cat?

Chelsea: Adumb is never going to change. You can’t control what he does. Aubree’s behavior is a direct result of Adumb being a shitty parent.

Kail: Do us all a favor and divorce Javi. You two are miserable together. That’s almost worse than being divorced.

Leah: Corey doesn’t have motives for wanting to see his daughters. He’s a good father, and all you do, is talk badly about him. Thank goodness he doesn’t do the same about you.  Miranda is the smartest one of them all. Leah seems high in every scene. Also, spanking Gracie should not have been the first thing she did. She needs Supernanny to show her how to properly discipline her girlses.

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Such as "treating" Jenelle to an island vacation to propose and inviting HIS friend, HIS brother with spouses and charging the whole affair to Jenelle.  THAT was what the fight that broke out was about.  That was also the reason he and Barb fell out the first time, Barbara feels that Nathan is using Jenelle for her money.  She's right, he is.

Was that visit to the attorney's office after the trip? With all the wonky editing, and so many scenes played so far, I can't keep the timeline straight.

 

 

I feel like Leah needs real help. If she has chronic migraines that knock her out (which are legit awful if you're also vomiting), she seriously needs help. I don't understand why she can't have someone come help her take the kids to school in the morning? If she is really struggling in the mornings, it seems like a good solution to have either one of the grandparents or a babysitter (or switch off between) with a key come in and get the girlses ready for the day, feed them and take them to school.

If that were the case, then Leah would never get out of bed. There is a great solution. Give custody to Cory and she can have visitation.  The girl has a drug problem. You don't enable druggies. There is a reason she went to rehab and it wasn't for migraines.

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You might be right that Leah needs some real help....but, to be quite blunt, Cory's main priority is making sure his girls get help. If my daughters were late to school every other day, making their own breakfasts, and I highly suspected my ex was using, you can be sure I'd be trying to get custody as well. I'm sorry if Leah has problems she cannot handle, but those babies come first.

 

I didn't say or imply otherwise.  Of course the babies come first.  Of course their fathers should do everything they CAN to protect and nurture them.  I never said or implied that Cory was WRONG, I said what Cory has done makes Leah, who IS wrong because she is sick, feel attacked and therefore even less likely to do the right thing because she thinks she will lose her children. I simply don't understand the modern mindset that people are so disposable.  Leah is 23 years old.  Her children are 5 and 2 respectively - so they should just write her off?  Divide the girls between their fathers and let the mother die in a gutter somewhere?  The hand that rocks the cradle rules the world.  If Leah can get straight then EVERYBODY will benefit from it - girlses, baby daddies, everybody.

Edited by Timetoread
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Did Adderall have scratches or scabs all over her legs? Is that normal for a baby who is whatever age she is?

I'm not a mom so maybe this will offend but I hope not. But if Leah wants to be a good mom, I think the best thing would be to let Cory have full custody. That girl is not right.

 

The scratches or scabs on another kid would be normal.  Kids that age climb a lot and typically have no fear.  Since we have just watched her kids unsupervised several times I have to assume she got them in the home which is less normal as I never see these kids playing in the yard.  

 

As to the second part, I am a mom, I had an addict parent, and yes having Corey have custody, having Jeremy's mom have Adderal and Leah having supervised visits until she can provide a stable environment would be the best for all.  I am sure she really loves the girls, but she is not doing right by them and they are unsafe.

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Not much new here, I'm starting to get bored with the show. But I did gasp when Aleeah slammed the door in Ali's face.

Jace's captain's costume reminded me of GOB wearing the stripper cop outfit on Arrested Development.

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I swear to God I think costumes were something Jace was into maybe a year or 2 ago. He looked so confused and Janelle had to remind him he loves costumes. He probably asked for a costume for Christmas once. I doubt she knows much of anything about him.

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I didn't say or imply otherwise.  Of course the babies come first.  Of course their fathers should do everything they CAN to protect and nurture them.  I never said or implied that Cory was WRONG, I said what Cory has done makes Leah, who IS wrong because she is sick, feel attacked and therefore even less likely to do the right thing because she thinks she will lose her children. I simply don't understand the modern mindset that people are so disposable.  Leah is 23 years old.  Her children are 5 and 2 respectively - so they should just write her off?  Divide the girls between their fathers and let the mother die in a gutter somewhere?  The hand that rocks the cradle rules the world.  If Leah can get straight then EVERYBODY will benefit from it - girlses, baby daddies, everybody.

 

Yea, and I'm not saying that Leah should just be tossed aside - nor do I think Cory wants that. Right now he's only asking for the same 50% custody he already has, just different days, so he can make sure the girlses are at least getting to school and bed on time when they're with him. If that makes Leah feel like she's being attacked, that sucks, but I just think he has to worry about the safety and well being of those little ones first. Maybe Leah's close family, like her mother or sister, should be the ones noticing how bad off she is and trying to get some help for her. But they're more interested in making excuses and validating her behavior. 

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Again I ask, has it been confirmed that Leah is an addict?  If so, to what?  She tested negative on the show.  Also, I must be missing a few eps, when have the girls been so unsupervised and egregiously in danger as to warrant permanent removal from their mother - to whom the court has repeatedly upheld custody?  The toaster thing was what Demon Girl told her father, not a report from the fire department.  We don't know the timing or situation of it or if it is accurate.  Leah might have been right on her heels when it happened.

 

I mean I don't love Leah that much, honestly, but this seems like a witch hunt.  Based on one scene (when clearly they weren't unsupervised because there was a camera crew present) and the hearsay of a 5 year old, people want to split up the family.  There are three sisters.  If it breaks up, Addy will live with her father and Ali/Gracie will live with theirs.

 

Also, on a side note, I DID see Leah do a Supernanny move - she put Gracie in the chair for 5 minutes (1 minute per year) and Addy in her own chair for 1 minute.  When their time was up, they supplied an apology and got a hug.  I LOL'd because I basically worship SN  - even though I don't have kids.


Yea, and I'm not saying that Leah should just be tossed aside - nor do I think Cory wants that. Right now he's only asking for the same 50% custody he already has, just different days, so he can make sure the girlses are at least getting to school and bed on time when they're with him. If that makes Leah feel like she's being attacked, that sucks, but I just think he has to worry about the safety and well being of those little ones first. Maybe Leah's close family, like her mother or sister, should be the ones noticing how bad off she is and trying to get some help for her. But they're more interested in making excuses and validating her behavior. 

 

Except it is not.  Leah is LIKING the idea of Corey having them through some of the week.  She's just not liking the reason/context of it being "because you suck."  What behavior are you talking about that is so heinous to make you worry about the girlses safety?  What excuses?  I guess I missed a bunch of episodes.  It seems to me that if Leah is as the criminal you make her out to be then Cory, Jeremy, and the grands are ALL complicit in knowingly allowing the children to live - even 50% of the time with somebody who is a danger to them.  Why isn't Miranda having her arrested?  What is wrong with these people allowing that monster access to those children? 

Edited by Timetoread

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Yea, and I'm not saying that Leah should just be tossed aside - nor do I think Cory wants that. Right now he's only asking for the same 50% custody he already has, just different days, so he can make sure the girlses are at least getting to school and bed on time when they're with him. If that makes Leah feel like she's being attacked, that sucks, but I just think he has to worry about the safety and well being of those little ones first. Maybe Leah's close family, like her mother or sister, should be the ones noticing how bad off she is and trying to get some help for her. But they're more interested in making excuses and validating her behavior. 

 

I totally agree. I actually think Corey has been pretty fair with Leah and I don't believe he wishes she would just disappear. For all her faults, her daughters love her and need their mother and Corey recognizes that. I think in Corey's perfect world, Leah would get her head on straight and they could co parent and the girls would have both their parents in their lives. That is why I think Corey promised Leah that if she would go to rehab, and focus on herself, he would not do anything custody wise until she got out. Yet Leah still ducked out of treatment early. She is not taking it seriously, does not believe she has a problem, and I can see how Corey feels like he has to take a stronger stand, even though the short term effect is that Leah sinks even further towards rock bottom. As reasonable as I think Corey has been over the last 6 years of filming, I don't believe he is seeking more custody and demanding drug tests just for funsies.

 

Also agree Leah's mother and friends are a huge part of the problem. In their efforts to be supportive, they are actually undermining her by telling her that she is a great mom and Corey is just doing this to be mean.

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Not much new here, I'm starting to get bored with the show. But I did gasp when Aleeah slammed the door in Ali's face.

Jace's captain's costume reminded me of GOB wearing the stripper cop outfit on Arrested Development.

 

I'll never get bored with this show as along as they continue to give us updates on Jace.   He has so many people rooting for him. 

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You know, I don't think Leah is a bad mom in the way I think Janelle is. There is no scenario I can come up with where Janelle is choosing her kids over drama. Girl likes drama because it stops her from being bored. She doesn't give a fuck about her kids other than as a way to make up more drama. I can see a scenario where Leah is a good mom. Maybe not some idealized Silverlake yuppie mom who sits around researching the best car seats and car seat buckling methods in Parenting magazine while her girls eat their gluten free quinoa salads in matching outfits order from Zuilly before they all bond over afternoon Mommy and Me yoga class. Let's be real, Leah is country as they come and those girls are going to get a country upbringing. However, I can see a future where Leah is getting the frito-pie casserole on the table and the girls are tucked into bed in matching sparkly SPOILED PJs by 9PM after everyone gathered around the TV to watch whatever TLC comes up with next. And I'm fine with that. That is actually a pretty great childhood. And I think Leah wants to and is capable of giving that to her kids, just not right now. Right now she needs a break. She needs to let Corey and Jeremy and whoever to take charge of the kids while she goes some place and figures out what is wrong and how to manage it.

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Why is Kai in daycare? Jenelle and Nathan do about as work in a day that Leah does. So unnecessary.

Yeah they don't work so he doesn't have to go to daycare, but on the other hand that might be the only time when he gets some quiet time without people screaming and fighting around him and even some normal human interaction and attention.

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Yeah they don't work so he doesn't have to go to daycare, but on the other hand that might be the only time when he gets some quiet time without people screaming and fighting around him and even some normal human interaction and attention.

That time in day care is the only time he will get the proper care (possibly except when he is with Nathan's mom).  Thank goodness for school.  He gets a break and some attention.  

 

The main thing that bothers me about Jenelle is she seems to go through the motions with her kids.  The only times she really seems to enjoy Jace is when he is happy about a new toy.  Maybe she is getting a bad edit, but we don't see her sniffing Kaiser's head or smiling at some silly thing.  As much as I hate the baby voice, Chelsea is a good example of someone who talks to her child and really enjoys the child.  Leah, for all her faults can also be seen enjoying her kids as can Kail.  Even Nathan seems to enjoy being a parent more than Jenelle.  I suspect it is from some form of mental illness, but she does not act the way a mother acts.  Farrah is a messed up, crazy narcissist, but you see her smile while watching her child some time and you feel like she likes her kid.

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Also, on a side note, I DID see Leah do a Supernanny move - she put Gracie in the chair for 5 minutes (1 minute per year) and Addy in her own chair for 1 minute.

 

Ha, I totally thought of Supernanny when she did that (I caught that one scene). She's got her Jo Frost moves down, at least: time-out for one minute per year of age, yep. And unlike most of the Supernanny kids who get up and have to be put back in the chair over and over and over again, Gracie at least stayed put while she carried on.

Edited by Chicken Wing
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Even Nathan seems to enjoy being a parent more than Jenelle.

 

That is so weird to me to see. I can't tell if it's for show so he looks good on TV, if he likes parenting out of some sort of narcissism (ie, Kaiser is a reflection of himself- but then why wouldn't he be interested in his daughter?), or if he actually enjoys being with his kid. I can't imagine it's the latter, but maybe?

 

I have never seen Jenelle act in a way that I find remotely maternal. I think any attention she pays Kaiser is solely to impress Nathan.

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What behavior are you talking about that is so heinous to make you worry about the girlses safety?

 

A five-year-old blow drying her own hair, unsupervised, in a bedroom right near the bed, while a toddler wanders around. A child strapped into her carseat with her backpack on her back. Two children stuffed into the back of an extremely cramped car, where no one can see out the rearview, and crap is falling on their heads right and left. I could probably think of more, but my memory kind of sucks and those are the more recent ones. 

 

As for the drug use, in real time she went to "rehab". Now I know everyone likes to say for "exhaustion and stress", but Leah's behavior on TV indicates to me she is abusing drugs or misusing her RXs. When you're falling asleep mid-conversation, something aint right. 

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I swear to God I think costumes were something Jace was into maybe a year or 2 ago. He looked so confused and Janelle had to remind him he loves costumes. He probably asked for a costume for Christmas once. I doubt she knows much of anything about him.

 

And she kept saying "You like to dress up!" -- like he's a little girl in Mommy's high heels. His face said: "I do??"

 

The older these kids get, the more I cringe when I see the parents arguing or badmouthing each other in front of them. It's horrifying. When Kail and Javi were having their non-talk and Isaac came in saying he hurt himself. That poor kid, he utterly LOVES Javi. Is anybody besides Jo and Chelsea really thinking about what's best for their kids? For the most part, these kids are mere props for their parents' drama. I am POSITIVE Kailyn has another guy in the wings, without a doubt. You can smell it on her, the smugness, the bullshit excuses. I have lost all respect for her, the way she is treating Javi. I have never seen Javi do or say anything to indicate that he's anything but a good guy trying his best to do the right thing, and knowing his crazy ass wife is weaving all kinds of invisible webs of drama where he's just a bystander.

 

When I was a kid, we were never given any attention or consideration, and we learned to take pride in it, in being tough, a survivor. And we would be scornful of other kids who cried or needed attention, who weren't tough like we were. We made fun of them for being spoiled brats. We resented them. Because we were jealous. Kail is doing everything she can to make sure her own kids validate her own upbringing (or lack thereof). She can't stand the idea of her kids having what she didn't. She's going to make sure they learn never to trust a father (or a mother, for that matter) to consistently care for you and place your wellbeing above all else. She has a fairy story in her head where all the unhappiness of her own childhood is magically healed by being the superhero single mom who makes her own mother look like a failure. "I can do it, why couldn't you?" Everything Kail does is, in one way or another, about her mother, I think.

 

I am also just blown away by how absolutely positively 100% sure she is that she is right all the time, that she's telling the truth, that she understands everything going on, that there is NOTHING ANYBODY can tell her that she doesn't already know. There is ZERO openness to even consider for an instant that there could be another way to see this or a different solution. I think that comes from defensiveness as well, feeling like she could never afford to be wrong or to admit that she might be wrong cuz someone would use it against her. She feels she has to defend herself every waking minute of every day cuz NOBODY is on her side. Which is all in her head!! ALL of her future relationships will fall into this same pattern. I feel very sorry for those kids. The only chance either of them has is via their fathers.

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Kail's absolutely ridiculous. She has SO much contempt for Javi that I'm almost positive she's got a Del State boy lined up. Keep gettin' dem benefits girl...ugh! And what is so outrageous about a married couple spending time together? Out with friends every weekend and her spouse suffocating her? Outrageous!

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Oh Kail, being done with her marriage already, doesn't even try to save it. I understand that sometimes its better to get divorced then fight but its only been a year since Lincoln was born and their problems started and she is already throwing in the towel. It seems like she doesn't want to be the one to pull the plug as not to be labeled home wrecker but is baiting Javi throwing words divorce and separation around him hoping he will be the one to file. She has no interest in making things work. She found a weak man that she could knock around and manipulate into going into military to get the benefits, probably hoping he would be deployed most of the time while she could play the military wife and going out with friends on weekends. Unfortunately Javi is home and it infringes on her social life and is getting controlling and jealous because he wants to spend time with his wife. So she conveniently rewrites history and is now saying they should have waited to get married. As I remember it was her pushing the marriage and military. I bet that when they get divorced eventually she will move far away cutting Joe and Javi from their kids (Javi can't really move whenever and wherever he wants and for Joe with Vee having new baby would be difficult to chase her around) so she can have them all for herself and to play poor single mom doing everything herself card. Or she finds another weak sucker to play house with. She might be considered good mom regarding that her kids are provided for and taken care of but trying to cut fathers who actually care for their children and want to be close to them is the worst, she has been actively trying to prevent Joe from spending more time with Isac for years. You would think that the way she grew up would teach her something but obviously it's the opposite. She is just horribly selfish. She will never be happy because she doesn't want to be, she prefers to be miserable and angry even though she has more than millions of people (and not only her age) - man who actually seems to be with her despite her terrible personality, healthy children, nice house, nice car, fame... she came from horrible situation on top but can't and won't enjoy her life.

P.s.: it killed me seeing her driving that car in bad weather holding phone and removing her other hand from the steering wheel while not even looking at the road but towards the camera. I'm pretty sure with that such an expensive car she doesn't need to hold that phone

Edited by ava111
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The scratches or scabs on another kid would be normal. Kids that age climb a lot and typically have no fear. Since we have just watched her kids unsupervised several times I have to assume she got them in the home which is less normal as I never see these kids playing in the yard.

When I was little I was always the kid with bug bites, scrapes, bumps and bruises because I spent every waking non-school minute outdoors. My mom actually used to panic about people thinking I was being abused because I always had some sort of injury. I agree it's normal for most kids, but odd for Leah's because they don't seem to do much besides crawl around on the floor.

Regarding the visitation center, Chelsea's getting a tough lesson on what happens when you procreate with losers. I think Chelsea is generally a good mom, but she's stuck with the douchiest baby daddy in the universe. Adam has one of those faces you just want to punch the crap out of, I don't know what Chelsea ever saw in him.

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I am POSITIVE Kailyn has another guy in the wings, without a doubt. You can smell it on her, the smugness, the bullshit excuses. I have lost all respect for her, the way she is treating Javi. I have never seen Javi do or say anything to indicate that he's anything but a good guy trying his best to do the right thing, and knowing his crazy ass wife is weaving all kinds of invisible webs of drama where he's just a bystander.

 

I agree. We have zero evidence so far that Kail is cheating or has ever cheated on Javi, but her attitude so far this season seems to indicate that she knows that she has options besides him. She knows she doesn't need to stay married to him to not be alone; she can jump to the next dick in a heartbeat, and she probably has one or ten waiting in the wings. Probably just strictly friends for now but definitely able to become more once she gives the all-clear.

 

It astounds me to know that in real time these two bozos are still together and have allegedly "worked past" all this and are back to ... whatever semblance of a happy relationship they kind of sort of had before. Kailyn is totally checked out. Javi is nothing to her but a baby-sitter who pays her. And that poor dopey schmuck just wants to make it work with her because, I don't know, he doesn't know any better? She was his first lay? She whopped him over the head one too many times and now his screws are permanently loose? I don't know why he bothers trying to control her or nose his way into every bit of business she has. Just pack up and go. There are plenty of manatees at the zoo if you need another one to gawk at.

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A five-year-old blow drying her own hair, unsupervised, in a bedroom right near the bed, while a toddler wanders around. A child strapped into her carseat with her backpack on her back. Two children stuffed into the back of an extremely cramped car, where no one can see out the rearview, and crap is falling on their heads right and left. I could probably think of more, but my memory kind of sucks and those are the more recent ones. 

 

As for the drug use, in real time she went to "rehab". Now I know everyone likes to say for "exhaustion and stress", but Leah's behavior on TV indicates to me she is abusing drugs or misusing her RXs. When you're falling asleep mid-conversation, something aint right. 

 

I don't have kids so I didn't know that 5 year olds weren't allowed to touch blow dryers.  The toddler was wandering around her own house - should she have been strapped in somewhere - or crated?  Leah was actually THERE for all of it.  It's not like they were home alone.  As for the cramped car, IIRC Jeremy was doing the driving.  He didn't do anything, execept bitch about it, why no calls to CPS on him?  In real time she is indeed in "rehab" but until we know the truth of why, it is just speculation and opinion.  And last I checked rehab is an indication of at least trying to fix problems.  Whatever, women are hard on women. 

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I swear to God I think costumes were something Jace was into maybe a year or 2 ago. He looked so confused and Janelle had to remind him he loves costumes. He probably asked for a costume for Christmas once. I doubt she knows much of anything about him.

I was thinking the same thing. Jace had a wtf look on his face when Jenelle gave him that stupid costume. Little boys might want to dress like a ninja or a pirate but I can't imagine a kid being excited about dressing like a boat captain. Jenelle is clueless when it comes to Jace.

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Ha, I totally thought of Supernanny when she did that (I caught that one scene). She's got her Jo Frost moves down, at least: time-out for one minute per year of age, yep. And unlike most of the Supernanny kids who get up and have to be put back in the chair over and over and over again, Gracie at least stayed put while she carried on.

 

The kids getting up used to make me howl.  It would take like 3 hours to enforce a 4 minute time out.  Hilarious.  That said, I loved Jo's style.  I miss that show.

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Yeah they don't work so he doesn't have to go to daycare, but on the other hand that might be the only time when he gets some quiet time without people screaming and fighting around him and even some normal human interaction and attention.

 

 

I don't have kids so I didn't know that 5 year olds weren't allowed to touch blow dryers.  The toddler was wandering around her own house - should she have been strapped in somewhere - or crated?  Leah was actually THERE for all of it.  It's not like they were home alone.  As for the cramped car, IIRC Jeremy was doing the driving.  He didn't do anything, execept bitch about it, why no calls to CPS on him?  In real time she is indeed in "rehab" but until we know the truth of why, it is just speculation and opinion.  And last I checked rehab is an indication of at least trying to fix problems.  Whatever, women are hard on women. 

It's not so much the blow dryer.  Another parent might allow a child to help with it in the bathroom, it is that hairdryers are risks for burns, there was zero supervision and she could have caught something on fire.  I would never dream of using a hairdryer next to bedding.  Yes, Jeremy also should have done something about the car.  Most fathers would have dumped the contents of the car on the driveway once they saw what happened.  The big deal for most people is that while many people are tired, 10 tardies in a month, your 5 year old waking up before you so often they tell dad about it an know how to feed themselves and do things like blow dry their hair are symptoms of a much larger problem.   She is using drugs or misusing what the doctors have given her.  This is not at all normal behavior.  I blame Jeremy just as much.  He knows what goes on and his child is still there.

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I don't have kids so I didn't know that 5 year olds weren't allowed to touch blow dryers. The toddler was wandering around her own house - should she have been strapped in somewhere - or crated? Leah was actually THERE for all of it. It's not like they were home alone. As for the cramped car, IIRC Jeremy was doing the driving. He didn't do anything, execept bitch about it, why no calls to CPS on him? In real time she is indeed in "rehab" but until we know the truth of why, it is just speculation and opinion. And last I checked rehab is an indication of at least trying to fix problems. Whatever, women are hard on women.

Leah went into rehab as a condition of being on the show. And she checked out early.

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The only chance either of them has is via their fathers.

 

I think Jo is an awsome father to have been a teen when things went down.  He honestly wants the best for his son and will do what's in his power to be there for him.  What I found interesting about Jo was his lovey dovey interest in Lincoln (who is so adorable and kind of demands that reaction).  I could see Jo honestly spending time with BOTH boys, since they are brothers so that Issac will never feel that he has to choose one family over the other.  Issac has Jo and that is alot.  Kail is loving, she just needs therapy to overcome her childhood.  That being said, I am shocked to see I am the only one who doesn't like Javi. 

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I was thinking the same thing. Jace had a wtf look on his face when Jenelle gave him that stupid costume. Little boys might want to dress like a ninja or a pirate but I can't imagine a kid being excited about dressing like a boat captain. Jenelle is clueless when it comes to Jace.

I used to babysit a boy who was really into costumes. Superheroes were his favorite, but he would have taken a ship captain in a pinch, although I have my suspicions he would have preferred something more fanciful and storybook like than that Love Boat get up. I could see that maybe Jace went through a costume phase, but it seemed like whatever Janelle was remembering was a while ago. The whole thing just reminded me of a relative who give you a toy you were really into the last time they saw you, 5 years ago.

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I used to blow dry my hair when I was Gracie's age. I think the concern in this situation is the fact that there was a toddler wandering around unsupervised who could have gotten burned if Gracie put down the dryer and Addalyn picked it up.

I co-sign that Kail has a guy waiting in the wings. She only throws divorce around a hundred times per episode, she's practically begging Javi to go ahead and file. I'm sure it will be no time before she moves in her next beta male and is pregnant with baby #3.

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Leah has the kids out until midnight on a school night. They are late to school 10 times in a month. They have to make their own breakfast and do their own hair. She is a terrible mom and a moron. The end!

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 That being said, I am shocked to see I am the only one who doesn't like Javi. 

Nah, you're not the only one. 

Personally, I feel sorry for the dude.  He's sort of pathetic.  But my hubs and my friend both hate the dude and think he's annoying and his dad should have taken him aside before he married Kailyn.

 

Now that they're married and he's in the...coast guard? army? Which one is it again? Is she covered with his benefits even after they divorce? Hubs says yes and she'll even get housing allowance, but his experience is with the Marines.  Does anyone know?

Edited by guilfoyleatpp

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Man, this was another tough episode to watch although not quite as painful as last week.

 

Jenelle: I get the feeling she just doesn't care about the burden on Barb. I have to admit I actually burst out laughing when she was talking to Jace about fishing and kept making sure to get those direct looks at the camera in there.  "Isn't he cute?  See?  I'm a great Mom!"  She even did it a little bit in the "I knew he'd love it" scene where Jace had that uniform on.

 

Chelsea: she knew Cole for 6 months before introducing him to Aubree?  Wow!  That may be a record for the girls on these shows.  Adam's gym buddy made me ask what the hell?  He looked like a mess. I hope in real time Chelsea/Aubree ended up getting the supervised visitation. 

 

Leah: wow for someone who used to be so vain, she was a mess on most of this episode. It looked like she was even struggling to start the dishwasher, or whatever she was doing next to the kitchen counter.  Ali throwing that nasty looking food away cracked me up - and she was so proud of herself for throwing it away (good job kid!).  To me Leah actually looked less drugged out, but more of a mess (although the whole "plotting" discussion seemed odd). I was wondering if it was withdrawals or perhaps a switch to new meds.

 

Corey normally impresses me a little more with his parenting and not letting the girls get away with stuff. When Gracie whacked Ali with the door I seriously wanted him to go get a screwdriver and take the door off entirely. Especially because he mentioned the "someone's going to get hit with a door" issue a couple of times, so apparently this has happened before. I think everyone was overwhelmed and perhaps even sick of the arguing in that part. I agree with those who say Miranda's a saint to want to take that on though! 

 

Kail: your husband wants attention from you, and to spend time together?  <gasp!> oh, the horror. Both of them made me so mad in their scenes. I still think Kail's probably got a guy lined up on the side. She seems to be quite surprisingly adept at that.

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Leah is nodding off. For God's sake, she looks like the people on Intervention. I can't fathom how someone could not see a problem with her.

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I don't have kids so I didn't know that 5 year olds weren't allowed to touch blow dryers.  The toddler was wandering around her own house - should she have been strapped in somewhere - or crated?  Leah was actually THERE for all of it.  It's not like they were home alone.  As for the cramped car, IIRC Jeremy was doing the driving.  He didn't do anything, execept bitch about it, why no calls to CPS on him?  In real time she is indeed in "rehab" but until we know the truth of why, it is just speculation and opinion.  And last I checked rehab is an indication of at least trying to fix problems.  Whatever, women are hard on women. 

Blow dryers can start fires. One's hair can get caught in the mechanism where the air blows in. I know, I had that happen a few times, and I am an adult. That hurt when it happened not to mention the noise it makes and the smoke that comes out from it after that happened. I panicked a little. I can't imagine what would happen in the hands of a five year old.

 

Evil Twin is also pretty cruel to her sister. I imagine the same could happen to the toddler. Toddler Addie goes near Evil Twin while she is blow drying her hair, and WHAM! she could hit her with the hair dryer.

 

As for Leah being THERE for all of it. Leah may have physically been there, but that girl was NOT MENTALLY there. I remember being on pain meds for an injury, and the need to get up in the morning was very difficult. I may have gotten up, but I could barely remember what day of the week it was. Having raised small children, one cannot be out of it. Even when one is at their worst, you either get someone to help in the house and the kids or you have a relative take them.

 

It is Leah who is always complaining she can't handle the stress and it is "too much" for her. This is not some parent who just had a rough night going to sleep. This is how she apparently is many times going by the fact that the court had to ORDER HER to get her kids to school on time and to not miss therapy appointments. Courts do not get into that unless there is proof that the parent is not doing their job properly.

 

And no, it is not women hating on women. Where does that come from? It is having an opinion.

 

 

It astounds me to know that in real time these two bozos are still together and have allegedly "worked past" all this and are back to ... whatever semblance of a happy relationship they kind of sort of had before.

This is likely because Kail's side piece was just all in her head. He never really wanted Kail. Maybe he just wanted to bang her, not share a life with her. So, back to Javi she goes.

Now that they're married and he's in the...coast guard? army? Which one is it again? Is she covered with his benefits even after they divorce? Hubs says yes and she'll even get housing allowance, but his experience is with the Marines.  Does anyone know?

I have no clue what part of the military he is in. I am still trying to figure out why he is home so much. Someone here posted that they would have to be married for at least ten years in order for Kail to receive benefits if they divorced.

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I think Leah has depression. It makes sense if you think about it. 3rd kid, 2nd failed (or failing, depending on the timeline) marriage. Marriage problems, money problems, overwhelmed by kids, life, everyone's needs. And throw in some anxiety meds that are blissful release from the reality of life and I get how it's hard to find motivation to do anything. Like, clean your car. Or get up at a reasonable time to get kindergartners to school on time.

 

There might be other things going on with her. I'm not saying she's a saint AT ALL. She is a flawed human being who consistently makes really bad choices because she has some disconnect with reality.

 

 The way the girls fight seems somewhat normal to me. I'm a younger sister (of two) with a very bossy older sister. She would get in trouble for being a jerk to me, but she couldn't (or didn't want to) help it. As adults we became much closer, but I'm still aware of the fact that she practiced her mean girl stuff on me first. The door in the face looked bad on camera (and made me gasp), but Allie was up and around immediately so it seemed she wasn't really injured. Aside from beating her constantly, I would guess there's only so much you can do with a kid like Gracie other than encourage her siblings to leave her the fuck alone when she's being a demon.

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Evil Twin slamming doors. Where do you think she learned that from? Mommy slamming doors when she is mad, out of it. pissed off at Jermy?

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The door in the face looked bad on camera (and made me gasp), but Allie was up and around immediately so it seemed she wasn't really injured. Aside from beating her constantly, I would guess there's only so much you can do with a kid like Gracie other than encourage her siblings to leave her the fuck alone when she's being a demon.

 

I noticed Ali put her arms up to protect her face before getting hit with the door, which I think helped a lot. That's another reason I think this probably happens somewhat regularly. I still say remove the door entirely until the kids can learn to behave so this doesn't happen. Someone could get seriously hurt. I think you're right, at some point you just have to tell them to leave each other alone. Even if it's Gracie's behavior that's unacceptable, Ali can probably help prevent getting in the middle of it by leaving her alone.

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