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Speculation for Lucifer: Purgatory

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IDK, I saw the pilot and it was rather clunky. I'm not impressed. But I'm not familiar with the comic/graphic novel so will give it a few more shots. Tom Ellis has the charm but also the douche. I was expecting a bit more class and restraint, he was coming on so effing strong. Will see. Again, I'm not familiar with the original stuff so maybe that was perfect.

Edited by tanita
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Just saw the pilot and I loved it. Tom Ellis exudes charm and douchiness, Lauren German is awesome too so I'm sold on the cast. The case was whatever but the dialogues were good, I laughed a lot. 

 

Can't wait for the rest of the show! I hope this will not be another american missed opportunity for Tom Ellis. 

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It was the only show I was looking forward to this season and I wasn't disappointed. It was a funny and entertaining pilot. I think that Lucifer has enough personality and T.Ellis enough charisma to carry the show, and L.German works great as the straight "man".

I just hope they'll  keep the second degree, it's what made it work so well for me. Considering the premise, the show will imo lose its charm the moment it takes itself too seriously.

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They have recast Lauren the "ex-maggot" (Nicholas Gonzalez). It's Kevin Alejandro now. I really like him, not that Gonzalez was bad or anything, so I'm happy is on board too. 

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They have recast Lauren the "ex-maggot" (Nicholas Gonzalez). It's Kevin Alejandro now. I really like him, not that Gonzalez was bad or anything, so I'm happy is on board too. 

I really like K.Alejandro, too, so I'm glad for him.

But I liked N.Gonzalez in his role. And I hope they won't recast the little girl because of the change. I can't believe what I'm saying because I'm so not a fan of kids on TV, but she was an element I loved and imo she made everything cliché on the paper work on camera.

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Very by the numbers, but also fun. Ellis is a good casting, he seems quite charismatic. Not sold on the female lead yet, hope her specialness will be exploredsooner rather than later, otherwise she's too generic.

Overall, I enjoyed the pilot, but I don't expect anything fresh from the show.

Edited by FurryFury

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Bumping this up as I have renamed this thread so that it can be a general speculation thread for S2 and beyond.

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January? Damnit. That's better than nothing but it clearly means another short season. I was hoping for a full season order.

So who is Mom?

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I have a feeling they'll bring it back whenever they bring X-Files back. Most X-Files fans think it'll be January 2017 when it comes back, and Lucifer's ratings were higher when it  piggybacked off of X-Files, rather than Gotham. I don't think an official date has been announced for Lucifer though

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The January is referring to January 2016 when the series premiered. (This is an old topic that was revived.) Most X-Files fans I know don't think X-Files coming back in the 2016-2017 TV season or Fox would have announced a renewal already.

 

The Lucifer writers room started season 2 on April 25 and Lesley-Ann Brandt said in a Facebook chat that the actors are going to start filming season 2 in a couple weeks. That seems to indicate that Fox is eyeing a September start for season 2. (In comparison, season 1 filmed from August 2015-January 2016.) Which could mean that it will be a short run from September to January like Sleepy Hollow, or go a full 22-episode season, maybe still paired with Gotham since they seem so compatible ratings-wise.

Edited by vampdetective

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I'm curious as to what the episode order will be. I think 22 is a lot these days for certain shows, an  this is one of them that we could end up with a hand full of "fillers." Empire is doing an 18 episode season, production preferred it I'm sure Fox would have given it as many as possible given its explosion last year, I think 18 is a good number. I don't know though how Fox would air Lucifer if it doesn't do an "average" 13 or 22 episode season, Empire had a long break between the first 10 episodes and then the last 8, I don't know how Lucifer would do with such a break since even though it seems to have found a solid fan base by end of the season it's not a huge one; waiting until 2017 seems like a terrible idea because of that reason too. 18 seems like a good number for shows in general to me. 13 never seems like enough even though that makes for a tighter/more together season. 

 

What's everyone's thoughts on "Mum"? I'm all for more supernatural less crime on the show but I just love how funny it is and don't want the humor to change, so, I kind of hope that whoever Mum is, she's a different race than either of her "sons", for everyone else's reactions. 

Edited by Gigi43
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I'm hoping for a 16-18 episode season. Fox could take a cue from The Walking Dead and run half from mid/late October to early December and half from late February to late April. Hiatus would still suck, but at least it would be manageable.

BTW, I really hate breaking shows up into A and B seasons. Can that stop now? Pretty please?

As for "mum", I'm not really sure what I want just yet. I had a fleeting thought of getting various guest actors for her and having a different mum each week. Slap some kind of mark on each one so the audience could keep track...I don't know. On the other hand, if the writing stays at the level of the finale, I want Betty White to be cast. The thought of her chewing scenery as the Devil's mom is just delightful.

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On the night the Season Finale aired, Lesley Ann Brandt shared a FB video of several of the cast members along with the showrunners goofing around and telling the west coast to get ready to tune in.  At the very end she says, "We'll see you, maybe this fall."  Obviously not definite, but I'm going to hold on to that tidbit and hope we'll see Lucifer in 5 months instead of 10!

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I binge watched this first season a last week-ish.  I'm already doing a re-watch to see what I missed during the first sitting.

I really (really, really) don't want them to 'ship Lucifer and Chloe.  I've seen comments around the web that they're in love and it made my skin crawl.

As to why Chloe isn't effected and why Lucifer is vulnerable around her: I hope they go with something like her -- on a subconscious level -- seeing him as his pre-fallen-angel self.  I kind of wish that during the scene when they were 'saving' Lindsey in S01.E04 Manly Whatnots -- when he was showing the brother his true face and she saw the reflection -- that she hadn't seen the demonic Lucifer, but something more like he looked before being cast out of Heaven.

I am surprised at how much I've liked the S01 run.

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Re Lucifer's vulnerability around Chloe, some have wondered if she's going to turn out to be quasi-supernatural herself -- say, an angel's daughter. Which made me wonder -- did Lucifer ever make work trips out of Hell? Maybe to personally collect some particularly warped soul on Earth, then seek out a party to wash the taste out of his mouth before heading back home, and drunkenly pick up a cute B-movie actress ...

In one way, it would be kind of a cliché if Chloe were Lucifer's blood daughter, but consider that for all the passes he's made at her, when she finally got blitzed and threw herself at him, Lucifer -- who's practically the personification of giving in to temptation -- wasn't even really tempted, discovering to his own astonishment that he cared about her rather than lusted after her. And other than the night she got wasted, she's never been slightly tempted by him. On some level, are they recognizing each other as family?

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From my history of watching US network TV, I can assure you they are not related. They are clearly set up as love interests (although this may change because of the somewhat lukewarm reception and lack of chemistry), and him not sleeping with her was definitely framed as "not taking advantage" rather than lack of actual desire.

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Pure speculation but ...

Since Luci was "killed" and Dad brought him back, wonder if he defaulted to factory settings, so to speak.

IE: Got his wings back. :)

I know from a purely production standpoint it's best to keep him without them, because the CGI for them is really expensive and he doesn't need them to be Lucifer but I can't help hoping.

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Being a big, big fan of The Mentalist I do find some of the same elements in the procedural aspect of the show and also in the chemistry between the leads.  

Just like Lisbon & Jane the attraction is there but hopefully won't be taken to another level for many more seasons.  And of course Lucifer is much more hedonist than the celibate Patrick Jane giving him more outlets for any sexual tension.

As to why Chloe makes him mortal a poster on the IMDB boards (wish I remembered the name to give proper credit) suggest Lucifer somehow unknowingly gave her some of his immortality when he saved her in the pilot.  I like that idea rather than the idea hat Chloe was some type of supernatural or angelic being. 

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2 hours ago, DaboGirl said:

Being a big, big fan of The Mentalist I do find some of the same elements in the procedural aspect of the show and also in the chemistry between the leads.  

Just like Lisbon & Jane the attraction is there but hopefully won't be taken to another level for many more seasons.  And of course Lucifer is much more hedonist than the celibate Patrick Jane giving him more outlets for any sexual tension.

As to why Chloe makes him mortal a poster on the IMDB boards (wish I remembered the name to give proper credit) suggest Lucifer somehow unknowingly gave her some of his immortality when he saved her in the pilot.  I like that idea rather than the idea hat Chloe was some type of supernatural or angelic being. 

For me the difference in Jane & Lisbon and Lucifer & Chloe is that the Lucifer executive producers and writers seem to be planning for Lucifer & Chloe to eventually get together. But I never got the impression that the Mentalist executive producers/writers planned that with Jane & Lisbon despite their chemistry. To get back to Lucifer, I think Joe Henderson said in an interview that he wants to focus more on forming the friendship and emotional intimacy first, so I am very hopeful that they will do a good job on that front. 

Concerning Chloe's influence on Lucifer...that actually occurred to be as well. What I find to be completely interesting is that not only can Chloe hurt Lucifer herself but he can be hurt just by being around her. This is complete crazy speculation and probably not true...but I wonder if there is some invisible energy field coming from Chloe toward Lucifer that makes him vulnerable. But that energy field appeared only because he saved her life/gave some of his immortality/power in episode 1. Because he was still completely immortal in episode 1 when Jimmy was shooting Lucifer and Chloe was there. But there is still something about Chloe because they showed before Lucifer saved her life that his powers didn't work on her.

Of course the Lucifer people could simply go the more human way rather than the mystical/supernatural way. Lucifer cannot influence Chloe because she is mentally strong, and he is physically vulnerable around her because he is emotionally vulnerable around her.

Based on what I have seen in season 1, I think the reason is going to be a combination of the supernatural and human/psychological. We'll see. 

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On 5/26/2016 at 11:15 PM, maskedmirror said:

For me the difference in Jane & Lisbon and Lucifer & Chloe is that the Lucifer executive producers and writers seem to be planning for Lucifer & Chloe to eventually get together. But I never got the impression that the Mentalist executive producers/writers planned that with Jane & Lisbon despite their chemistry. To get back to Lucifer, I think Joe Henderson said in an interview that he wants to focus more on forming the friendship and emotional intimacy first, so I am very hopeful that they will do a good job on that front. 

Concerning Chloe's influence on Lucifer...that actually occurred to be as well. What I find to be completely interesting is that not only can Chloe hurt Lucifer herself but he can be hurt just by being around her. This is complete crazy speculation and probably not true...but I wonder if there is some invisible energy field coming from Chloe toward Lucifer that makes him vulnerable. But that energy field appeared only because he saved her life/gave some of his immortality/power in episode 1. Because he was still completely immortal in episode 1 when Jimmy was shooting Lucifer and Chloe was there. But there is still something about Chloe because they showed before Lucifer saved her life that his powers didn't work on her.

Of course the Lucifer people could simply go the more human way rather than the mystical/supernatural way. Lucifer cannot influence Chloe because she is mentally strong, and he is physically vulnerable around her because he is emotionally vulnerable around her.

Based on what I have seen in season 1, I think the reason is going to be a combination of the supernatural and human/psychological. We'll see. 

I hope they go with the "emotionally vulnerable = physically vulnerable."  That seems like a place where there'll be better story to mine than "Well, Lucifer, when you saved Chloe, your phlenobob tangled up with her Rhotencian astralor, causing you to become vulnerable when she's around you.  To fix that, we're going to need to immanentize your eschaton by getting a bunch of goofy-looking props and speaking psuedomystical technobabble, because telling emotionally resonant stories is harder than speaking a bunch of silly nonsense words."

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I didn't want to clog up the media thread, but, with the casting news this week I've been thinking about the coming season, and I also have have Person Of Interest on the brain with it coming to an end, so here's what I want for next season:

 

Lucifer isn't consulting with the LAPD, so much as it's him and Amendadeil needing access to any kind of information the LAPD has that they need but can't access and the havoc Mom is doing (whatever it may be) with also result in Dan/Chloe getting getting cases that they are also looking into and they get brought into Lucifer's investigations/cases more than Lucifer is brought into the cop , much in the same way PoI used their NYPD cops. They touched upon in this first season how there was guarding all the lost souls in hell so there can be other cases involving other escaped beings from hell for them to deal with aside or after they settle their mom problem.

 

Tricia Helfner better bring the scary, or I'll be so annoyed they had Rebeca DeMornay playing a ditzy character when she's so good at bringing the creepy (that is, if she can with whatever she did to her face.) Rebeca wouldn't be my choice of casting for the role but at least I'd be comforted by her scary factor.

 

Also now that Lucifer disappeared -actually disappeared!- in front of Chloe and then Dan (Dan saw both brothers disappear no less), they need to cover the "they get he's the devil" very early in the season, preferably the premiere, or it will just be ridiculous.

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I don't think Chloe has to be otherwordly for her impact on Lucifer to be explained. Maybe she just doesn't have evil enough in her to be susceptible to his "hypnosis" - she is, I think, susceptible to his charm, just not to his usual tricks. In the same way, maybe Lucifer needs enough degree of evil around him to be immune to evil, and maybe she has so much goodness that she counteracts the evil. I know this might sound barf-inducing, but because I don't buy Chloe as having angelic roots, that's the best I can come up with at this stage.  

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Personally I would rather she have some angelic roots than just being that special. Being angelic gives her a reason to be special. If she's just special because the show wants to play "will they won't they" with a twist then that just sucks. And I see nothing, NOTHING special about her whatsoever. She's not a great cop, she's not some stunning beauty (she's very pretty, just not like Helen of Troy beautiful), she's not the most moral person to ever walk the earth, not that they've shown. She's just...there. Maybe she's too boring to be affected by him? Maybe she lacks any sense of imagination? Seriously, for someone who did a topless scene in a teen exploit movie she is dead boring. If they go with, she's just this side of being a robot and therefore can't be affected by, well, anything, I would buy that over her being so special just because she's the female lead.

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12 hours ago, Mabinogia said:

 If she's just special because the show wants to play "will they won't they" with a twist then that just sucks.

Personally, I can't stand the old 'will they won't they', a twist wouldn't help either; we've seen way too many shows ruined by this and it's about time writers think of something original instead of just relying on this whenever there's a male lead and a female lead. Still hoping Lucifer won't go down this road, but definitely not holding my breath. Other than that, I couldn't care less about the reason for Chloe being 'special', she's still too poorly acted for me to care about her. The only reason I don't want her to check out what's going on in the afterlife is Trixie.

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I wish Trixie had been the one who was immune to him. 1) because it would mean they would have to interact more, and I LOVE Lucy and Trixie scenes 2) it would make narrative sense. She's a child and therefore quite innocent. So it makes sense she would have no dark hidden desires yet and 3) it would just be different.

He would still have to work with Chloe so the show could keep their extremely cliché in every way female cop (seriously, Chloe is like the poster child for every female cop cliché in the book. Too pretty to be a cop, checkered sexualized past, isn't taken seriously, super serious, probably in attempt to be taken seriously, the non-believer. It's like they had a check list) in order to have access to Trixie because he is fascinated by her immunity and what it all means. Without making Chloe also the cliché's "Only one who..." Usually it's "gets him" or "knows how to handle him" in this case it's "is immune to him". Yawn

 

It's a good thing Tom Ellis is so damned charming and all the non-cop characters are great.

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I remember Battlestar Galactica.  Tricia Helfer can absolutely bring the scary if she's allowed.  Maybe they can flash back to their infancies...

Helfer: "Luci, have you been a good baby?  Yes, you have.  Ami, have you been a good baby?  Yes, you have.  Aw, Uri, you made a doo-doo.  Bad baby!" *necksnap*

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On 1.7.2016 at 3:14 PM, johntfs said:

Helfer: "Luci, have you been a good baby?  Yes, you have.  Ami, have you been a good baby?  Yes, you have.  Aw, Uri, you made a doo-doo.  Bad baby!" *necksnap*

I like the way you think.

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A new "love"interest for Lucifer?  

“Lucifer” Season 2 proves more intriguing as the show will mainly focus on looking for mom but love interest will spice up the show as Garcia will be able to get Ellis’ attention away from German.  

Sportsrageous:  Looks like Aimee Garcia would make things interesting when “Lucifer” Season 2 hits the small screen by Sept. 19. Rumors are swirling that she is being groomed to be the love interest of Tom Ellis.

Instagram:  photo of Lucifer and Chloe on Dr. Linda's coach

The caption in the photo teases “Lucifer” Season 2 would show Chloe Decker and Lucifer Morningstar eventually becomes a couple.  Lauren German, who plays Chloe, also hinted this happens between the characters in an interview with DC Entertainment. German said she would love to see Chloe and Lucifer rekindle their relationship when asked about the pair’s romantic story line.

Which is true? Lucifer/Chloe or Lucifer/Ella  or are both just wild speculations to fuel our imaginations and eager anticipations?

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Not surprising about Luci and Chloe but still annoying. Chloe is such a dud. I don't hate her but her insisting on avoiding Luci's charms is like the most interesting thing about her.

Edited by FurryFury
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rekindle? Rekindle what? Did they have a "relationship" to rekindle? I'm on team girl who hasn't even shown up yet you still has to be better than Chloe.

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On ‎12‎.‎07‎.‎2016 at 6:28 AM, DaboGirl said:

A new "love"interest for Lucifer?  

“Lucifer” Season 2 proves more intriguing as the show will mainly focus on looking for mom but love interest will spice up the show as Garcia will be able to get Ellis’ attention away from German.  

Sportsrageous:  Looks like Aimee Garcia would make things interesting when “Lucifer” Season 2 hits the small screen by Sept. 19. Rumors are swirling that she is being groomed to be the love interest of Tom Ellis.

Instagram:  photo of Lucifer and Chloe on Dr. Linda's coach

The caption in the photo teases “Lucifer” Season 2 would show Chloe Decker and Lucifer Morningstar eventually becomes a couple.  Lauren German, who plays Chloe, also hinted this happens between the characters in an interview with DC Entertainment. German said she would love to see Chloe and Lucifer rekindle their relationship when asked about the pair’s romantic story line.

Which is true? Lucifer/Chloe or Lucifer/Ella  or are both just wild speculations to fuel our imaginations and eager anticipations?

Considering Lucifer's history, it's not hard to imagine that he'll have a fling with the new girl but will eventually end up with Chloe. And suggesting that the new girl could be a love interest will definitely be good for all those click-bait websites out there because people will want spoilers.

Personally, I would find it refreshing if Lucifer actually ended up with someone else other than Chloe but, unfortunately, the show seems to be hell-bent (no pun intended) to be cookie-cutter and do what everyone else does. I even read that they're continuing to explore Lucifer's increasing mortality, so it sounds like they plan to actually take more of what makes Lucifer stand out away. I had hoped that after Lucifer's brief return to hell and return to earth he'd be back to where he started and they'd play with that for a while. Could have been so much fun. However, daring and being different and taking risks doesn't seem to be in many showrunner's vocabulary.

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Video from Comic-Con! Be warned, there is some sneak peek stuff after the season one recap, so if you're totally spoiler averse, you may want to stop after the season one stuff.

 

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So, it looks like they're adding yet another cast member... I'm excited to get another brother, if it were up to me, they could make Chloe and the whole police business secondary, however, if this brother has more than a guest role, we have 10 main/major characters (including Trixie). That works in a show like CSI which is about the case and investigation and not the characters but it's definitely too many for a show like Lucifer in which it's about the characters and their journey. http://tvline.com/2016/08/08/lucifer-season-2-michael-imperioli-cast-uriel/#comment-list-wrapper

Edited by CheshireCat
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It kinda seems they want to focus more on the angel side of things, judging by the new castings. I hope that's what happens because the crime procedural stuff has been done to death. Let the show evolve into something a bit less generic.

As for the size of the cast, I'm guessing most of the new characters (and hopefully some of the old ones because I really don't give a damn about Kevin Alejandro's character) are only going to appear sporadically.

Edited by FurryFury
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This just better be a build up to the most epic family therapy session of all time.

Edited by Gigi43
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I have no concerns about Tricia Helfer being able to bring the scary.  Her Caprica had moments where she was completely terrifying.  As an actress, she has the ability to carry that line between manipulation of the target through charm, zealotry, or sex, while posing a constant threat to the target's welfare.  I'm really excited about that addition.

I'm also not worried about the inclusion of other new cast members.  A bigger cast isn't necessarily a risk in a show that has a strong serial component.  I would hate to lose too much of the wonderful Rachel Harris, but she serves such a helpful role in moving forward the emotional development, without taking up all that much screen time, I don't anticipate real risk.  The idea Gigi43 suggested, about a shift in the nature of the serial, from cop work to Mum Hunt, would allow greater focus on the central characters, while limiting the day players.  They could accomplish a similar approach by putting Chloe on a single case that spanned multiple episodes, or having her cases largely arising from Mum's bad behavior.

So looking forward to S2!  Can hardly wait.

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Why is Chloe immune from Lucifer influence?

Who else is immunize from his influence?  Trixie?

I have not seen any hard evidence of WHY Chloe is immune from Lucifer "charms".  Has anyone else?  They were suppose to show us some evidence at the end of the first season.  But I did not see any of that in that episode. 

So why do you think she immune from his charms.   What the evidence to prove this theory? 

Edited by gwhh

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9 hours ago, gwhh said:

Why is Chloe immune from Lucifer influence?

I have not seen any hard evidence of WHY Chloe is immune from Lucifer "charms".  Has anyone else?  They were suppose to show us some evidence at the end of the first season.  But I did not see any of that in that episode. 

So why do you think she immune from his charms.   What the evidence to prove this theory? 

Since this is for speculation ...

Given the compelling arguments I've seen on the latest episode thread about the idea that the make-up on Lauren Graham is deliberately making her look sallow and dead, I'm wondering if the writers are going to circle back on what happened in the pilot.

This may be giving the writers too much credit.  Don't get me wrong I really, REALLY like the Lucifer writers and I think they've done a very good job, especially in the first season when it came to nuance.  But I've been burned so often in scripted TV where an interesting tidbit is brought up and then completely dropped so faith is a little hard to come by. 

However, speculation.

At the end of season one Lucifer has now twice stepped in to save Chloe's mortal existence.  In the pilot, we hear him say "I won't let you, Father will have to wait" and it was then confirmed by Maze in something of a throw away line "You saved a mortal?" and I believe Amenadiel also mentioned it.  Then in the last episode, Lucifer made the deal with Dad for Chloe to be safe.

And of course there is the whole situation with Lucifer's mortality around Chloe.

I just don't think these things are throw aways.  Lucifer and Dad in the mix, around a mortal soul?  Early on in the pilot Chloe could have simply been one of those people with a strong will but after that it feels like Dad was in the mix .. in a subtle way.

Okay comics time, spoiler bar incoming:

Spoiler

I know the show has stepped away from the comics in terms of story but bear with me.  In the comics Yahweh is not a villain per say but he is THE MASTER MANIPULATOR.  Even Lucifer doesn't stand up to his Dad's skills.  But it's logical that Yahweh would be this way, he created everything and he knows everything.  THE PLAN.  But in the comics we see a Yahweh who has grown tired of his creation.  He's abandoned the Silver City and is looking to his two first born for one to step up.  Lucifer isn't interested since he just wants out of Dad's influence (though Luci shows up and saves the Silver City a couple of times) and Michael doesn't want to believe Yahweh is abandoning them and then ends up dead.  So Yahweh determines he'll get help choosing whether to reach back in time and undo his creation (obliterating it all) or abandon it to it's own devices.

So in that respect, Dad could be in the mix without being a bad guy but his motivations are not always clear, even to his kids.

It's my speculation that Chloe is a pawn Dad is using to lead his wayward son in the direction he wants.  I think Lucifer inadvertently brought Dad's attention to her when he intervened in the pilot and everything since has been Dad playing his pawn piece.

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