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S01.E08: Chapter Eight: Know Your Truth 2018.05.13

Season Finale!

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Barry vows to give up his life of crime, once and for all. Pazar enlists Vacha's replacement to take care of Fuches. Moss and her team close in on a major arrest with hopes of finally cracking the Madison case.

 

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I'm gonna third it.  Just completely blown away.

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Wow!  I didn’t think they would go there, but again, they did.  It felt so weird when they switched to the country with all of the daylight.  They killed the most relatable character!  The actress was excellent in the role. Oh poor Gene. I guess that is one way to clear the cast for a new big bad and a new detective for season two. I hope Hank makes it into the next season. 

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And that happened...

Shiiiit. Poor Barry. I know, I know, I shouldn't feel this way...but...DAMN. This show makes me rethink everything...

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5 minutes ago, MarMar said:

 It felt so weird when they switched to the country with all of the daylight.

I kept thinking it was one of Barry's daydreams (and I did watch the behind the scenes that tells us that was intentional). I kept thinking Barry would be back in reality before it went too far. And then it went too far. I've always liked that actress and I'm super sad she's gone! But as long as NoHo Hank is around to order up a submarine sandwich (he's polite!) I'll be okay. 

Now I can cancel HBO until Barry comes back!

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Apparently there's some? doubt about whether or not Barry killed her...as in they're not saying and we didn't see it.  But I can't imagine how they could justify keeping her alive knowing what she knows.  At the same time, I love the actress and the character so part of me hopes they find a way.

This was also one of the funniest episodes of the season.  That twin killer using the saw to build stocks?  Hilarious.  As was Goran's death scene.  Or how the press conference spent so much time talking about that one movie. 

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I have no earthly idea where the show will go from here and, honestly, I’m not sure I’ve ever felt that before. 

All the praise to Bill Hader for somehow making this work, and a special shout-out to Noho Hank for being the most adorable gangster I’ve ever seen. (A sentence I never thought I’d type - this show is full of firsts for me.)

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Unless I hear or read definitively otherwise, I am  open to the possibility that everything from the sunny hammock scene to the end was a dream/nightmare or maybe part of Barry's "acting process."

Because otherwise…
Darn Facebook.

And yes (of course) if Sally hadn't convinced Barry to stay, Janice would still be alive (because everything Sally tells Barry is tainted), but, also, maybe he wouldn't have survived without her acting-as-therapy talk. 
IDK. Is that a real thing?

So Fuches lives on to screw with Barry another day. Fuches knows when to walk away.

Heh, Sally should have a last name like Fuches too. Or maybe "Reed" is because in Barry's daydreams heretofore she's always been like Donna Reed.

The water sounds during the closing credits were riveting and very reminiscent of the Breaking Bad swimming pool that showed up in the credits for a whole season until we learned that the drug death of Jessie's girlfriend because Walter White chose not to save her resulted in her air-traffic-control father crashing a plane, IIRC, with toys dropping from the plane into the pool.
Anyway, I presume here we were hearing her bloated body floating in the water by the dock.

Unless it was all a dream.

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Damn!  I figured Janice was going to find out the truth, but I figured it was going to be more of a final season Breaking Bad Walter/Hank situation.  But baring a ridiculous twist, Barry just killed her.  I'm really speechless.  I have no idea where they will go from here.  Did he hide the body and everyone is just going to think she just disappeared? Or will be stage it like an accident?  How will this effect Sally?  Or especially Gene?  Hell, this will no doubt bring the rest of the police force in, if one of their own just disappears or gets murdered.  I'm certainly glad HBO has already renewed this!

That was one hell of a headshot Goran got!  I'll miss Glenn Fleshler going forward, but I so love that NoHo is not only still around, but ended up working a deal with the equally polite and nice Bolivian mobster!  I hope they bring him back: I want to see NoHo in charge!

Have to think that Fuches will somehow worm his way back onto the show.  Barry punching him twice was so satisfying at least.

Overall, really enjoyed this season and I hope it gets some award love.  Bill Hader was fantastic in particular, and I also got to show love to Stephen Root for embracing the sliminess and sinisterness of his character, and Anthony Carrigan for just being so damn hilarious with almost every line and reaction shot.  Can't wait for more of it next year!

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Not sure what really snapped Barry out of it.  NoHo's call warning him?  Some sense of debt he felt towards Fuches, to not let him be killed?

Premise of the show is that he can't keep his past life and the future life he wants separate.

Yeah you'd think the cops are going to want to know the 3 people Janice was last seen with so Barry will always be looking over his shoulder.

Meanwhile, NoHo and Fuches will probably try to draw him back to the life.

I thought for a second he was going to murder the 3 of them at that table but Janice played it cool, pretended not to notice Gene was talking about a hired killer.  

 

So now the body count of good people he's killed is up to 2.  If he keeps killing good people or people who have the misfortune to find out his secret, it will be difficult to see him as a sympathetic character.

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2 hours ago, scrb said:

thought for a second he was going to murder the 3 of them

Strategically, to stay alive and out of prison, he should have, and in terms of skills, we know he was quite capable.
But then no Sally dreams and no acting therapist.

 

2 hours ago, scrb said:

So now the body count of good people he's killed is up to 2.  If he keeps killing good people or people who have the misfortune to find out his secret, it will be difficult to see him as a sympathetic character

And if "he keeps killing good people or people who have the misfortune to find out his secret," Barry himself will find it more difficult to keep saying, "I'm a good guy."
Should we start calling this the Walter White Syndrome, or does it already have a name?

Note that Sally expects him to tell her his dark secret since she shared hers. But then he'd have to kill her. 
That will be a heck of a dilemma.

 

And just in case I haven't yet posted it for this episode: Bravo for the tight storytelling and acting.

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That was quite a time jump. Barry sand Sally are lovers. I must've missed where Fonzie had acquired some nest egg as a child star or something to afford that big california country house. That plus Janice the cop and him also appear to be an item where she always seems half revolted and embarrassed by him.

I like this show. Hader's voice and face is made for comedy but when  he's 'serious' and angry, I imagine him being that way in his real life. He would come off as very creepy and psycho looking

Edited by 100Proof.
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1 hour ago, 100Proof said:

That was quite a time jump. Barry sand Sally are lovers. I must've missed where Fonzie had acquired some nest egg as a child star or something to afford that big california country house. That plus Janice the cop and him also appear to be an item where she always seems half revolted and embarrassed by him.

I like this show. Hader's voice and face is made for comedy but when  he's 'serious' and angry, I imagine him being that way in his real life. He would come off as very creepy and psycho looking

I don't recall the show ever saying he didn't have money. He may be reduced to auditioning for "guy in line" and running a acting class but it doesn't mean that he didn't once have an actual acting career.

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I absolutely loved this. If this had been a miniseries, I think this would have been a great ending (and one of the best miniseries I've ever seen,

That said, if the scenes at Gene's country house were real, I have a hard time believing that Barry would be able to take down the cop. What could he have done, reached for a hidden gun? She would have blown him away before he had a chance. It's not like she was a shaky civilian who didn't know her way around a weapon.

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11 minutes ago, Blakeston said:

That said, if the scenes at Gene's country house were real, I have a hard time believing that Barry would be able to take down the cop. What could he have done, reached for a hidden gun? She would have blown him away before he had a chance. It's not like she was a shaky civilian who didn't know her way around a weapon.

Maybe she was hell-bent on taking him in alive?

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5 minutes ago, Blakeston said:

That said, if the scenes at Gene's country house were real, I have a hard time believing that Barry would be able to take down the cop. What could he have done, reached for a hidden gun? She would have blown him away before he had a chance. It's not like she was a shaky civilian who didn't know her way around a weapon.

I was wondering if it was real, as well. What did he do with her body? Her car? How would he explain what happened? Was it a dream?   Yet we heard muffled gun shots.  It really had the makings of a bad dream, and we've seen Barry's daydreams where he's happy with Sally, etc.   I can't believe he'd have a FB page with links to Chris & the other marines. Esp since HE KILLED CHRIS. 

I need a submarine sandwich. 

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And, I need some chicken ala king.....Damn....I screamed so loud I woke up my senile shih tzu. Seriously. Too bad he didn't kill Sally, we hate her and 
her "process". Love love love this show especially all of Barry's cute little Dexter tee-shirts. Best comedy on television! (Yeah, I am just that sick).

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1 hour ago, MrWhyt said:

I don't recall the show ever saying he didn't have money. He may be reduced to auditioning for "guy in line" and running a acting class but it doesn't mean that he didn't once have an actual acting career.

Didn't Janice the cop go over Gene's apt. or house at some point? I don't remember. If so, was it the kind of place a guy with money would have? He does drive a big black SUV. Lol, none of this is important.  Maybe the writers overlooked his backstory. I dunno, he just seems like one of them hack actors who had a few, as you say, standing in line roles, and then opens up an acting school. However, maybe that's a stereotype fostered in me from movies and tv shows in the first place, lol.

I just thought the forward time jump and 'all is well and they all hang out together' vibe was too much, as folks are saying, like a daydream scene.

Edited by 100Proof.
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1 hour ago, Blakeston said:

I absolutely loved this. If this had been a miniseries, I think this would have been a great ending (and one of the best miniseries I've ever seen,

That said, if the scenes at Gene's country house were real, I have a hard time believing that Barry would be able to take down the cop. What could he have done, reached for a hidden gun? She would have blown him away before he had a chance. It's not like she was a shaky civilian who didn't know her way around a weapon.

He had hung a gun, hand height, on a tree, in case he had to take her out. 

 

I really  hope it was a nightmare, and he didn’t really kill her, but I’m thinking he really did. 😔

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Oh yeah, she is dead and buried. But yeah, where did that rifle come from? That was just too convenient. I don't think Gene would hang guns from his trees, it's just not part of his process. 

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I think Barry prepares for every eventuality. He hung the gun. 

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48 minutes ago, 100Proof said:

Didn't Janice the cop go over Gene's apt. or house at some point? I don't remember. If so, was it the kind of place a guy with money would have? He does drive a big black SUV. Lol, none of this is important.  Maybe the writers overlooked his backstory. I dunno, he just seems like one of them hack actors who had a few, as you say, standing in line roles, and then opens up an acting school. However, maybe that's a stereotype fostered in me from movies and tv shows in the first place, lol.

He had a pretty nice house. I could see him as having a few good roles in 70s or 80s, using the money to buy real estate, and then using small parts and the acting class to pay for upkeep and taxes. 

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9 hours ago, scrb said:

So now the body count of good people he's killed is up to 2.  If he keeps killing good people or people who have the misfortune to find out his secret, it will be difficult to see him as a sympathetic character.

I see Barry as sympathetic only because he's on a lose/lose mission to finding himself because who he is is what he has always been—an assassin. That's what he's best at. That's what he does. He keeps wanting to escape it but he falls back so easily into it—with Chris and now, presumably, Janice—that he's deluding himself he can ever change. His romantic relationship with Sally at the cabin struck me as contrived and forced—like he's acting a part of "Man in Love" but this time in real life and not on the stage. When Janice asked him if he wanted to do movies or TV and he gave that old cliched answer of, "I love the stage best" (or something to that effect), it seemed so...affected. Like, he knew that was the "right" bullshit answer to give on the test only so he'd clinch the A.

I think, to me, this is a show about a man who has convinced himself that he wants to change, and that he's a "good person." But Barry has done little work to change his killer's nature—and can't contain his most basic instinct, to kill— and most awful people think they're really just misunderstood "good" people. I like this show but think Barry is an un-redeemable creepy psycho.

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Oh yeah, she is dead and buried. But yeah, where did that rifle come from? That was just too convenient. I don't think Gene would hang guns from his trees, it's just not part of his process.

My take: Barry clearly picked up on her interest in his stage name over dinner and was tracking her from then on to see how she was going to follow up on it. He went to bed but basically stayed attuned to her doings so when she left the house he followed her to the dock, and hung his gun on the tree in case he needed it before confronting her. (It surprises me zero that he would have had one hidden in the car.)

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Thanks, you are right Henderson, he knew she was catching on, yep. But still, damn it, I really loved her.  Sally caused this by opening an inane Facebook page for Barry. 

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Damn you Facebook! 

Holy shit, until the dinner scene, I thought that was all just one of Barry's fantasies! I thought Barry killing Chris would be the dark crescendo of the season, but this might be even worse. Poor Janice. She was a good person and a good cop who seemed happy with weirdo theatrical Gene, and then it all ends. And yet, I still cant bring myself to hate Barry. Whats the matter with me? 

How is it that in a show filled with murderers, criminals, and narcissists that I still hate Fuches the most? Because he is a combination of all three? Of course he manages to still slime away, living to be a dick another day. At least Barry punched him in the face and told him where to shove it, even if he still didnt want him to die. Might have cheered a little bit. 

It was a quick bit, but I laughed when Sally was telling Barry how she never tells anyone about her marriage...except for like half the class and Gene. 

Hope this show cleans up at the awards show, even if its another one of those weird dramadys that are kind of in an awards category no mans land. 

NoHo is alive! Yes! I love that guy, he is just the nicest, most lovable gangster ever. 

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Oh I am with you about NoHo.....I adore him, why, because he is polite! And he lived to be in season II....... 

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Barry was feeling blah before he went to LA.

He was wading through life, not trying to cause a stir but also, not stirred up by life.

Does he get the acting bug or does acting open him up in ways he hadn't imagined before?

I can kind of see the comparison to Dexter when he falls for what's her name.  He'd been repressed overall because he was hiding deep trauma.  Barry the show hasn't really explored Barry the character's backstory in depth.  Maybe it will or maybe PTSD from his military service will serve as shorthand for the dysfunction.

Seemed like Barry was prepared to slink back into the shadows when Sally convinced him into staying, which he really wanted to do  because going back to his previous life was a bleak prospect.

So he wasn't going to give up his new life.  He wasn't as anguished about it as having to kill Chris but he really hoped he could convince Janice -- he could have ambushed her without pleading with her.

In the inside the episode, Berg says they filmed the camping scene like a dream, with the way they did the sound design and the idyllic dream.  Of course Barry was going to do whatever he could to continue living that dream.

I  wonder if they could even make most of next season about this new life he aspires to, with minimal encroachment.  They kept Noho around so that probably won't happen because it would be a dramatic change from this first season.

Ultimately the show could be heading towards a bittersweet ending.  So far the viewers don't want him caught, no more than they wanted Tony Soprano caught or killed.  Same with Dexter to an extent, though they seemed to want Walter White to get his just desserts.

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1 hour ago, tennisgurl said:

Holy shit, until the dinner scene, I thought that was all just one of Barry's fantasies! I thought Barry killing Chris would be the dark crescendo of the season, but this might be even worse.

Oh I think it's way worse. With Chris Barry could at least tell himself that he was doing it to protect Chris's wife and son. Killing Janice was pure self preservation for Barry.

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5 hours ago, cardigirl said:

He had hung a gun, hand height, on a tree, in case he had to take her out. 

But wouldn't she have fired at him before he had a chance to reach for a gun, aim it and pull the trigger? I can buy that Barry is a quick shot, but not that quick.

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I think we're suppose to give some dramatic license that Barry is lethal and in this case, triumphed to keep his secret hidden.

 

Obviously if Barry is arrested or if Janice kills him reaching for the gun, there is no more show.

 

This was just the eighth episode of the series.  They obviously plan to produce several more seasons, if the ratings hold up.

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I hope the ratings are good, I love it, Anybody know how the ratings are doing, I know the critics adore it.

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Was this the series finale?

No, it was the season finale. It has already been renewed by HBO for a second season.

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1 hour ago, Blakeston said:

But wouldn't she have fired at him before he had a chance to reach for a gun, aim it and pull the trigger? I can buy that Barry is a quick shot, but not that quick.

I'm guessing he also jumped behind the tree for cover. That would've given him a few extra seconds in which he knows what he has to do to Janice but she doesn't know how to react to him. 

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18 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

I want to see NoHo in charge!

I want to see a half hour sitcom called NoHo In Charge! I loved when Goran grabbed him by the collar, pulled him up and asked "Are you in love with Barry?" NoHo's hanging there but still puts his hands on his hips and tries to strike a casual pose! And I don't know why but it cracked me up after he listened to the sirens for awhile then "Okay, that's definitely for us. That's not good. Hey, fellas?" I'm happy he's happy with the Bolivians. They're small but they're friendly.

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3 hours ago, Blakeston said:

But wouldn't she have fired at him before he had a chance to reach for a gun, aim it and pull the trigger? I can buy that Barry is a quick shot, but not that quick.

I think he has the element of surprise.  As long as he's not reaching in a pocket or his clothing, she probably isn't considering that he's reaching for a gun behind a tree.  And by the time her brain caught up, he's shooting.

Plus, he shoots to kill more often than she would. 

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8 hours ago, MaryWebGirl said:

Oh I think it's way worse. With Chris Barry could at least tell himself that he was doing it to protect Chris's wife and son. Killing Janice was pure self preservation for Barry.

Me, I don't think there was one moment when Barry didn't realize he was killing Chris to save himself. That's why he was so ripped up by guilt afterwards. The "save the wife and son" rationale was for Chris' benefit, to try to persuade him to keep quiet.

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4 hours ago, Irlandesa said:
8 hours ago, Blakeston said:

But wouldn't she have fired at him before he had a chance to reach for a gun, aim it and pull the trigger? I can buy that Barry is a quick shot, but not that quick.

Plus, he shoots to kill more often than she would. 

Yes.
Janice may have been a good detective with a necessary degree of skill with a gun, but Barry was a really good hitman. I'm sure that gun was suspended in such a way that it would effortlessly (for Barry) slide into his hand in the precisely perfect position to be fired instantaneously with his unerring, reflexive aim.
I'm not sure (7" wide screen), but I think the gun was suspended at the same height his hands would be when held in the air at her request. And Janice would be expecting Barry to reach for an object on his person—not on a tree trunk.

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On 5/13/2018 at 9:54 PM, Nordly Beaumont said:

I kept thinking it was one of Barry's daydreams (and I did watch the behind the scenes that tells us that was intentional). I kept thinking Barry would be back in reality before it went too far. And then it went too far. I

I don't think it happened.

Barry was awfully "normal" in those scenes, socially. That alone is a major shift for his character. Also, what was the meaning at the end of Barry saying to himself, "Begins ... now?" That seemed to signify something ending or something beginning, in his head or his dreams. Maybe he read that book that the Bolivian and the nice Chechnyan recommended. It was a self-help book, wasn't it?

Maybe most importantly, it is very rare for shows to take that kind of jump forward, especially intimate shows like Barry with such a small scope and character set. We would have to believe that Barry has progressed so far in his acting that he and his actor girlfriend and their acting coach are all planning future shows and building on some kind of success. Barry? The guy who only acted well once, and that was after he killed his long-time friend? Are we supposed to believe that Barry changed his personality AND his acting ability that quickly? 

I don't buy it.

Also, what was the significance of the one police saying that whoever shot the Chechnyans was either short or crouching? Was that just Barry thinking ahead and shooting in such a way that would be the belief? I kept wondering if he used his sniper rifle at an angle and that meant something, but maybe it was just Barry being clever.

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42 minutes ago, Ottis said:

Also, what was the meaning at the end of Barry saying to himself, "Begins ... now?"

Earlier in the episode, he'd told Fuches when storming out that his new murder-free life "begins now." (Or words very much like those.) So since that didn't work very well, he resolves to start the murder-free life now.

If we're voting, I vote that everything we saw was real. Don't think Barry's arc makes much sense if it wasn't.

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24 minutes ago, Milburn Stone said:

Earlier in the episode, he'd told Fuches when storming out that his new murder-free life "begins now." (Or words very much like those.) So since that didn't work very well, he resolves to start the murder-free life now.

Thank you. I somehow missed the first reference.

24 minutes ago, Milburn Stone said:

If we're voting, I vote that everything we saw was real. Don't think Barry's arc makes much sense if it wasn't.

I agree, my issue is that the show is asking us to believe too much happened, too quickly. If what we saw happened, say, a season from now, I would be on board. If it truly did happen in reality as we saw it, that's a damn gutsy move. Also, I think it wants us to believe Barry's ability to change from what he has been all season, to what was basically a social and personal maestro, happened in what ... a few weeks? A month or two? If so, IMO that's a misstep, because it goes against everything we have seen about Barry.  He wasn't awkward and stifled because he was a hit man. It was the other way around, and it started well before he became a hit man (at least while in the military). Ending his career as a hit man for a few months wouldn't change who he is to that degree.

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1 hour ago, Ottis said:

Also, what was the significance of the one police saying that whoever shot the Chechnyans was either short or crouching? Was that just Barry thinking ahead and shooting in such a way that would be the belief? I kept wondering if he used his sniper rifle at an angle and that meant something, but maybe it was just Barry being clever.

Being shot by someone at that angle gave the police a reason to believe that it was the Bolivians responsible for the hit.  It refers to the established fact that all Bolivians are very short in the "Barry" world.  Also distance wise, it would make more sense for Barry to use a handgun when saving Fuches.

 

I believe that everything at the cabin was in Barry's head.  Just a dreamy scenario of how his life would be spurned on by Sally's wanting to partner up for another scene.  But subconsciously, he ruins it because he knows it will never end well.

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It's both horrifying and hilarious that Goran conducted his business in the suburban home where his family lived.  In addition to the kiddie car in the garage, I'm pretty sure I spotted an American flag which I'm sure he put out on the 4th.

I think poor Janet is sooo dead.  I knew she was dead as soon as Barry began begging her to not make him kill her. He made the same plea to Chris.

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Being shot by someone at that angle gave the police a reason to believe that it was the Bolivians responsible for the hit.  It refers to the established fact that all Bolivians are very short in the "Barry" world.

 

I know not all Bolivians are short, but this little bit of show mythology amuses me because as a 5'7" human, I did often like a $*#&@ giant when I was in Bolivia.

Bolivia really is a lovely place. Not everyone is in a gang and/or short! Go visit!

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