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GH History Lessons: Because History is Always Repeating Itself

Just now, Melgaypet said:

Ugh. Am I the only one with a visceral dislike of Jensen Buchanan? I'm not even talking about a reaction to her off-screen behavior (which, is she still in jail?), but that she just turns me off. I never have been able to stand her, in any role.

I liked Tammy. I enjoyed the scenes where she was confessor to so many Port Charles men - Luke, Alan, Tony. Even Lucky in a few scenes. I was glad when she started running Kelly's and got her own little stories.

I can't STAND her. Was never so happy when she got booted.

I liked the original Tammy. I can't even remember what the recast looked like.

I think she had some personal problems in real life and the show fired her? I can't remember.

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2 hours ago, Melgaypet said:

Ugh. Am I the only one with a visceral dislike of Jensen Buchanan?

I don't mind what I've seen of her as Megan's sister Sarah (Sarah Roberts' namesake, mind you) on OLTL.

2 hours ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

 

I liked the original Tammy. I can't even remember what the recast looked like.

 

This is Tamara Clatterbuck, or Tammy 2.0. Prior to GH, she played Alice on Y&R (Cassie's adoptive mother before Sharon got her back), and then had a brief role on DAYS after she left GH.

 

Tamara_Clatterbuck.jpg

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4 hours ago, Melgaypet said:

Ugh. Am I the only one with a visceral dislike of Jensen Buchanan? I'm not even talking about a reaction to her off-screen behavior (which, is she still in jail?), but that she just turns me off. I never have been able to stand her, in any role.

I liked Tammy. I enjoyed the scenes where she was confessor to so many Port Charles men - Luke, Alan, Tony. Even Lucky in a few scenes. I was glad when she started running Kelly's and got her own little stories.

Re: Buchanan, I'm sure you're not, but I never felt that way. I thought she was great, a better actor than a lot of daytime would-be legends, and even did as well with Melissa Bedford as anyone could have in the circumstances.  The personal situation is unfortunate.  

I liked Tammy too, but I completely lost interest in seeing her when she was recast. Tamara Clatterbuck was hard and charmless in that role.  

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On 2/18/2018 at 10:48 PM, UYI said:

How many people actually know what Luke did to Laura? Was it considered an open secret in town for years? Does Robert know? 

Unless it was addressed at some point after Robert un-died, Robert has no idea.  But he hasn’t really been around enough for some random scene where he finds out, or the writers don’t care if he knows.  

The people who knew in the 80s were Bobbie, Scott and eventually Laura’s parents Lesley and Rick and Bert. Then everyone started calling it a “seduction” and pretended there was no rape until the late 90s.  And then Lucky and Liz found out, but I don’t know if they told others.  Did they?

Apparently Lulu eventually found out so probably Tracy heard about it at some point, if it was still when Luke and Tracy were a thing.  

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1 minute ago, SlovakPrincess said:

Unless it was addressed at some point after Robert un-died, Robert has no idea.  But he hasn’t really been around enough for some random scene where he finds out, or the writers don’t care if he knows.  

The people who knew in the 80s were Bobbie, Scott and eventually Laura’s parents Lesley and Rick and Bert. Then everyone started calling it a “seduction” and pretended there was no rape until the late 90s.  And then Lucky and Liz found out, but I don’t know if they told others.  Did they?

Apparently Lulu eventually found out so probably Tracy heard about it at some point, if it was still when Luke and Tracy were a thing.  

And it was Nik who told Lucky; and marblemouth Teethan, who clued Lulu in.

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Ew, why would Ethan know and why would he have told Lulu??   Does that mean Holly told him — although she was never around at the times the show was acknowledging it as rape.   

Not that the writers actually give a crap, but whatever .. 

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1 minute ago, SlovakPrincess said:

Ew, why would Ethan know and why would he have told Lulu??   Does that mean Holly told him — although she was never around at the times the show was acknowledging it as rape.   

Not that the writers actually give a crap, but whatever .. 

I think Teethan was told by Lucky? Luke? And he told Lulu, assuming she already knew. 

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I love how none of these idiots in her family put any thought into whether and / or how Lulu should be told this, or whether Laura was ok with her daughter having this information.   

Edited by SlovakPrincess.
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Lulu told Ethan. When Kristina accused Ethan of hitting her, Lulu said she couldn't help but think there might be a chance it was true because she really didn't know him that well, and if Ethan really was that much like Luke then that meant that maybe Ethan was capable of violence too, since Luke had raped their mother.

1 minute ago, SlovakPrincess said:

I love how none of these idiots in her family put any thought into whether and / or how Lulu should be told this, or whether Laura was ok with her daughter having this information.   

That's not what happened. Lulu found out by accident at a hearing over who should have guardianship over Laura while she was in the mental hospital. I think Scotty brought up that Luke shouldn't have guardianship partly because of the rape.

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On 3/12/2018 at 10:51 AM, TeeVee329 said:

Speaking of Mike's Alzheimer's and things he's flashing back to as part of it, wasn't he part of "Port Charles" for a while?  Didn't he own or run the Recovery Room, and wasn't he dating the Scanlon matriarch?

Yes re: the Recovery Room; he rented the back apartment to Dr. Matt Harmon, too. I don’t specifically remember him dating Mary Scanlon, but now that you mention it, I think they may have gone out a few times (or attended evernts together) before Mary started dating Victor (Kevin’s father), whom she later married.  

Edited by curlyblackeggs.
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20 hours ago, ulkis said:

That's not what happened. Lulu found out by accident at a hearing over who should have guardianship over Laura while she was in the mental hospital. I think Scotty brought up that Luke shouldn't have guardianship partly because of the rape.

I feel like that's when they were really ramping up Scotty being THE EVUL.  Wasn't he trying to get himself assigned the guardian, even though he and Laura hadn't been married for six billion years?

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4 minutes ago, TeeVee329 said:

I feel like that's when they were really ramping up Scotty being THE EVUL.  Wasn't he trying to get himself assigned the guardian, even though he and Laura hadn't been married for six billion years?

Yup.

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Luke tells Lucky that he raped Laura:

Edited by ulkis.
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Jensen Buchanan was part of the show's nadir. I couldn't stand her on GH.

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Ugh, neither could I. Her character was typically awful, to boot, which didn't help.

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On 3/13/2018 at 4:47 PM, SlovakPrincess said:

The people who knew in the 80s were Bobbie, Scott and eventually Laura’s parents Lesley and Rick and Bert. Then everyone started calling it a “seduction” and pretended there was no rape until the late 90s.  

 

Did Lee & Gail know? Since they were/are Scott's parents I was curious about that. (Of course, they were also at L&L's big 1981 wedding, so...awkward.) 

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On 3/11/2018 at 6:31 PM, ulkis said:

By the way, @Bringonthedrama , hope I'm not coming across too strongly. That's  the great thing about the writing from then. You could dissect every angle for hours.

Admittedly too Luke at that time is on my list of favorite GH characters.

 

Nope, no offense taken @ulkis. While I thought TG, GF, and JJ had awesome family chemistry (and now feel that TG did a lot of his best work with JJ), I really didn't like the way Luke spoke to Laura regarding Nikolas and the Cassadines. I thought referring to Nikolas as her "demon spawn" (or close to that at least), pressuring her to have nothing to do with him, and acting like her desire to connect with her son was a betrayal of their Spencer family was totally out of line. I saw Luke trying to shut her down and usher her out of the morgue when she was going off on Sonny and Jason as one of the times he was trying to control her words/actions when they bothered him. 

I don't think Laura was harsh to say they didn't "have kids" because A) Sonny married Lily for business, then stayed with her because of the pregnancy, and certainly never became a father because of the explosion that killed her. He did not lose a beloved child.  B) Jason had been raising AJ's son that he helped Carly and then S&C keep away from A.J. Just because he 'felt like' he was Michael's father didn't make it so.  Neither of them had a clue as to how Laura was feeling from losing a teenage son she had raised from birth. 

Edited by Bringonthedrama.
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On March 17, 2018 at 4:53 PM, UYI said:

Did Lee & Gail know? Since they were/are Scott's parents I was curious about that. (Of course, they were also at L&L's big 1981 wedding, so...awkward.) 

Since I had to hunt around for any clips of that era, I don't really know.    The sequence of it is that Scott finds a letter Laura wrote to Luke essentially telling him she forgives him, and then Scott yells at Laura and rushes off to beat the crap out of Luke right as Luke is about to marry mobster Frank Smith's daughter ... and then Luke and Laura go on the run from Frank Smith.    Scott was yelling incoherently the whole time, and then for a while people thought Luke drowned after Scott threw him in the harbor.  So, the whole reason Scott flipped out was kind of lost in the chaos, and by the time they realized Luke was not dead, everyone just assumed Luke and Laura had been cheating before they ran away together.  

Scott becomes angry and bitter and his relationship with Lee and Gail goes to hell, too -- so he may not have ever told them the full story.  

Lee and Gail ending up at the wedding is actually interesting -- Lee actually hates L and L for about a year, blaming them running off together for Scott's change in personality.  Lee, who is a recovering alcoholic, falls off the wagon and burns up Laura's divorce papers from Scott, which almost derails the L and L wedding.  But he apologizes to them, and then L and L sort of cover for him so he won't lose his license to practice law.   Of course, by that point, the writers had retroactively made the rape not a rape.  

In summary, the whole thing was bizarre.

Edited by SlovakPrincess.
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I just watched the video in the Press Club section about looking back on GH character's histories. MB says with a smirk "I killed my son's father, but he deserved it" and SBu laughs hysterically in response. SBu says he's killed like 75 people and adds, "That's pretty cool, right?" This makes me want to watch Sonny and Jason even less, if that's possible. 

Just a warning to any of you watching the videos ...

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I have a little time right now to catch up on the GH I've missed....which is a lot. Over the past year and a half, are there any episodes that you particularly remember being worth watching? I wouldn't expect anyone to give me actual air dates, but if there are scenes you think I should catch, I can probably find them.

 

Thanks!

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18 minutes ago, TheGourmez said:

I have a little time right now to catch up on the GH I've missed....which is a lot. Over the past year and a half, are there any episodes that you particularly remember being worth watching? I wouldn't expect anyone to give me actual air dates, but if there are scenes you think I should catch, I can probably find them.

 

Thanks!

Do you like Franco? People seemed to like last Friday's episode (the 6th).

Oh, and the episode where Jason jumped through a (ridiculously placed) skylight. I think it was Nov 3rd or something like that.

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21 hours ago, ulkis said:

Do you like Franco? People seemed to like last Friday's episode (the 6th).

Oh, and the episode where Jason jumped through a (ridiculously placed) skylight. I think it was Nov 3rd or something like that.

I keep trying to talk myself into liking Franco, because I sure as hell don't want to watch Steve Burton anymore.  I don't mind Franco as much as others do. Thanks for the suggestions. I'm not sure I can handle Jason doing anything but rolling off a dock these days.

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On 4/15/2018 at 9:23 PM, TheGourmez said:

I have a little time right now to catch up on the GH I've missed....which is a lot. Over the past year and a half, are there any episodes that you particularly remember being worth watching? I wouldn't expect anyone to give me actual air dates, but if there are scenes you think I should catch, I can probably find them.

Thanks!

TheGourmez, I'd steer you to shows from about mid-January to present. There has been a jump in quality.  I have a few things that would be easy to search for: Nathan's funeral (not a fan when he was alive, but the episode was good soap opera); the recent anniversary episode, and all of the scenes involving Mike Corbin (Max Gail) and his Alzheimer's disease. That story began in early February and has been front-burner since.  

The dementia story has gotten good work out of everyone in it, Gail himself most of all. But there have also been good scenes for Vernee Watson-Johnson as Stella (Curtis's aunt), now a hospital social worker who's trying to give the Corinthos family some guidance, as well as Dominic Zamprogna, Chad Duell, Laura Wright, Rebecca Herbst, Matt Cohen, and others who have had scenes with Gail. Maurice Benard is Maurice Benard, and Sonny is of course being written as the character who doesn't "get it" and gets frustrated with Mike, but even he's had his moments.  

The current, recently promoted co-head writer, Chris Van Etten, is intelligent, loves the genre, cares about his characters and his audience, and isn't one of the usual cynical burnouts. He can't fix everything himself, but I'm enjoying the day-to-day writing now more than I have in a long time.  I still complain when I have to, but I haven't missed an episode in a while.  

Edited by Asp Burger.
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On 4/17/2018 at 6:07 AM, Asp Burger said:

TheGourmez, I'd steer you to shows from about mid-January to present. There has been a jump in quality.  I have a few things that would be easy to search for: Nathan's funeral (not a fan when he was alive, but the episode was good soap opera); the recent anniversary episode, and all of the scenes involving Mike Corbin (Max Gail) and his Alzheimer's disease. That story began in early February and has been front-burner since.  

The dementia story has gotten good work out of everyone in it, Gail himself most of all. But there have also been good scenes for Vernee Watson-Johnson as Stella (Curtis's aunt), now a hospital social worker who's trying to give the Corinthos family some guidance, as well as Dominic Zamprogna, Chad Duell, Laura Wright, Rebecca Herbst, Matt Cohen, and others who have had scenes with Gail. Maurice Benard is Maurice Benard, and Sonny is of course being written as the character who doesn't "get it" and gets frustrated with Mike, but even he's had his moments.  

The current, recently promoted co-head writer, Chris Van Etten, is intelligent, loves the genre, cares about his characters and his audience, and isn't one of the usual cynical burnouts. He can't fix everything himself, but I'm enjoying the day-to-day writing now more than I have in a long time.  I still complain when I have to, but I haven't missed an episode in a while.  

Noted, thank you, Aspburger!

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With Anna and Dr. O squaring off tomorrow, I went back to watch some old clips and I actually stumbled across a scene between Anna and Britt I really dug.  Anna's "Don't interrupt me" in the middle of Britt's backtalk is so badass:

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1 minute ago, TeeVee329 said:

With Anna and Dr. O squaring off tomorrow, I went back to watch some old clips and I actually stumbled across a scene between Anna and Britt I really dug.  Anna's "Don't interrupt me" in the middle of Britt's backtalk is so badass:

 

What HAPPENED TO THIS ANNA?????

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I was watching the Fan February episode, which introduced the idea of Taggert being Sonny's step brother and Gia being his sister. How come they didn't do this storyline on the actual show?

If the mark doesn't work, FF to about 21 minutes in:

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MB probably realized that continued, prolonged exposure to Real Andrews's insane charisma would blow him off the screen and put the kibosh on it.

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Instead we got Courtney and Ric. I loved Ric despite of what he did on the show but I will always resent that he could get Gia as Sonny's sister. 

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My favorite scene of Gia. :)

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She could've been so good as  Sonny's sister - and we would've been spared SWSNBN

Edited by Oracle42.
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I'm kind of glad Sonny got shackled with SWSNBN instead of Gia, even if we suffered.

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2 hours ago, Oracle42 said:

She could've been so good as  Sonny's sister - and we would've been spared SWSNBN

Why would you want something so awful to happen to her?

1 hour ago, dubbel zout said:

I'm kind of glad Sonny got shackled with SWSNBN instead of Gia, even if we suffered.

Ditto.

I loved how Taggert's contempt for Mooby never changed or abated. And he wasn't just a cardboard character, either. I still remember how gentle he was with Liz after her rape.

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1 hour ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

I loved how Taggert's contempt for Mooby never changed or abated. And he wasn't just a cardboard character, either. I still remember how gentle he was with Liz after her rape.

Those scenes were so, so good. The entire story was written with a care and sensitivity we don't get at all today. Sigh.

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On 6/22/2018 at 9:29 PM, dubbel zout said:

Those scenes were so, so good. The entire story was written with a care and sensitivity we don't get at all today. Sigh.

That was probably due to Michele Val Jean, who actually is a rape survivor, taking over a lot of that story (and she is probably still the only GH writer to ever truly CARE about Liz, let alone actually LIKE her). Guza actually wanted to have the rape be a random girl (basically a footnote in the larger Luke & Laura/rape revisited story), only to be reminded of Liz and Sarah, and basically choosing them in some gross, blase, "flip a coin" sort of way.

Yes, they technically did pick the better character with the better actress, but that's not really a credit towards him. 

Edited by UYI.
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I remember reading that BH spent a lot of time talking to MVJ about her (MVJ's) rape so that BH could get it right for Liz. How Guza chose the character to be raped doesn't reflect well on him, but what does is that he gave the story time to run. Compare that to how slapdash Alexis's lung cancer story was handled. 

I don't much like how Mike's Alzheimer's story is really all about Sonny, but it is being given a decent amount of time to play out, especially compared to how terrible the general pacing of the show is. There are still problems, of course, but the depiction is not as terrible as I'd feared.

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High school.  I think because Robin was super smart she was in advanced classes with Jason or something, or at least knew him and AJ somewhat well because Anna and Monica were friendly and the Qs and Scorpios knew each other.  So she was hanging out with the older kids already and she and Brenda became best friends pretty quickly when Brenda came to PC as the new girl.

AJ should have been starting college at this point, but of course he knew everyone through Jason.

 

oh man, those baggy early 90s jeans — lol.

 

fun fact: Robin was originally one or two years older than AJ (AJ gets born in 1979, when baby Robin would be living offscreen in NYC).  Jason is born in ‘82.  AJ and Jason were SORASed to make the early 90s teen scene.

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49 minutes ago, SlovakPrincess said:

oh man, those baggy early 90s jeans — lol.

I know. And the acid wash! 

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Aw, poor dead Karen.

And hey, remember when "Night Shift" teased Jagger and Robin for a second there?

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Man, I am rewatching the introduction of Carly in 1996 and it is so good! They CLEARLY had a story planned out in advance, and the character of Carly was so brilliantly played by Sarah Brown. A few observations:

 

*  Carly was so much smarter about people back then—to a point. She quickly figured out what everyone wanted and gave it to them, and it only started to collapse when her own lies and insecurities caught up to her.

* Her introduction to the other characters is almost flawless—almost like a newly created flashback. Her first meeting with Jason is scored to “I’m the Only One” by Melissa Ethridge! In her first meeting with AJ Quartermaine, there’s a little flicker of something between them. Maybe not a plan for them, but the show made it a point to introduce these two legacy characters without forcing it.

* Oh my god, Tony is such a terrible husband. I watched this the first time, but with a modern sensibility it’s even WORSE. He doesn’t respect Bobbie personally or professionally and has no self awareness. He gives Carly $5,000 to pay for nursing school—in front of Bobbie, without discussing it with Bobbie—and then gets all whiny when Bobbie brings up the clear conflict of interest (she’s the head of the nursing program AND paying for a student she must evaluate??)—not to mention not giving away thousands of dollars without talking to your spouse first! But. Even though terrible, it was totally believable and relatable—it didn’t feel “not Tony,” who was often totally self righteous.

* Jason really was crap to Robin AND Carly, he deserves to have her meddling after all these years.

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It is SO obvious that KMc was the only real teenager in that group. Not helping matters is that she looked younger than her age for years, so she looked closer to 10 than 14. 

6 hours ago, SlovakPrincess said:

fun fact: Robin was originally one or two years older than AJ (AJ gets born in 1979, when baby Robin would be living offscreen in NYC).  Jason is born in ‘82.  AJ and Jason were SORASed to make the early 90s teen scene.

There are scenes in the 80's where Steve is reading the Christmas story where Robin is sitting with Jason; he may have even been on her lap. Makes knowing what came later on VERY weird in hindsight.

And now (well no, I've wanted this for a long time now), I'm wishing Robin had been involved with in a triangle with AJ and Jason, except that SHE would be the older woman. That would've been MUCH more interesting! (Plus, no SBu!)

Edited by UYI.
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Is the Brenda actress standing on a box? She can't be that tall in her scenes with Mo.

34 minutes ago, lizzbert said:

*  Carly was so much smarter about people back then—to a point. She quickly figured out what everyone wanted and gave it to them, and it only started to collapse when her own lies and insecurities caught up to her.

That makes so much sense psychologically.

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19 minutes ago, statsgirl said:

Is the Brenda actress standing on a box? She can't be that tall in her scenes with Mo.

 

VM is short, like 5'2. Kelly Monaco, by contrast, is 5'1. And I want to say Kim is around that, too.

So yeah, that's kind of jarring.

Edited by UYI.
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I was super bored last week and rewatched a bunch of early '90s potboiler thrillers including Consenting Adults, the wifeswapping movie with Kevin Kline, Mary Elizabeth Mastrantonio and a bleach-blond Kevin Spacey wielding an Uzi. It's from '92. Kimberly plays their kid and has a grand total of maybe two lines.

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4 hours ago, lizzbert said:

Man, I am rewatching the introduction of Carly in 1996 and it is so good! They CLEARLY had a story planned out in advance, and the character of Carly was so brilliantly played by Sarah Brown. A few observations:

 

*  Carly was so much smarter about people back then—to a point. She quickly figured out what everyone wanted and gave it to them, and it only started to collapse when her own lies and insecurities caught up to her.

* Her introduction to the other characters is almost flawless—almost like a newly created flashback. Her first meeting with Jason is scored to “I’m the Only One” by Melissa Ethridge! In her first meeting with AJ Quartermaine, there’s a little flicker of something between them. Maybe not a plan for them, but the show made it a point to introduce these two legacy characters without forcing it.

* Oh my god, Tony is such a terrible husband. I watched this the first time, but with a modern sensibility it’s even WORSE. He doesn’t respect Bobbie personally or professionally and has no self awareness. He gives Carly $5,000 to pay for nursing school—in front of Bobbie, without discussing it with Bobbie—and then gets all whiny when Bobbie brings up the clear conflict of interest (she’s the head of the nursing program AND paying for a student she must evaluate??)—not to mention not giving away thousands of dollars without talking to your spouse first! But. Even though terrible, it was totally believable and relatable—it didn’t feel “not Tony,” who was often totally self righteous.

* Jason really was crap to Robin AND Carly, he deserves to have her meddling after all these years.

In limited defense of Tony, by 1996 his first wife Tania had been killed in a hit and run accident, daughter BJ had been killed in an entirely different accident, and he’d found out about Bobbie cheating the same day that BJ died.  So ... basically his life sucked by this point and his marriage with Bobbie already included loads of resentment and passive aggression.  

Carly worked well as a character at first, but by the time of the Baby Michael reveal that made Jason turn on Robin, I was just plain exhausted with her. 

Edited by SlovakPrincess.
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I'll admit that as I've gotten older, I've become less sympathetic to Tony in regards to his affair with Carly. Yes, she's done a lot of awful things, but the feminist in me can't help but point out that Tony was the one who was married. She didn't hold a gun to his head.

I know, I know, it's a TV show. But I care about being fair to women both real and fictional. Personal growth and all that. ;)

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35 minutes ago, SlovakPrincess said:

In limited defense of Tony, by 1996 his first wife Tania had been killed in a hit and run accident, daughter BJ had been killed in an entirely different accident, and he’d found out about Bobbie cheating the same day that BJ died.  So ... basically his life sucked by this point and his marriage with Bobbie already included loads of resentment and passive aggression.  

Tony's affair was understandable, but that doesn't make it right. Carly's whole reasoning for seducing him—because Bobbie had the gall as a teen hooker mom to give her up for adoption—was not. It's not as if Carly's childhood was so terrible. Virginia and Frank Benson didn't have much money, but Virginia genuinely loved Carly and did her best. Frank wasn't the greatest, but wasn't he retconned a bit to be worse than originally described?

At any rate, it was Carly's jealousy and greed, traits she still has today, that got all of this rolling.

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