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Mothers, Mentors, and Mates: Relationships

James hasn't started anything with Lena - yet; you have an opportunity here, Kara! ?

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If they do plan on putting Kara and Mon-El back together, him being married is a BIG hurdle. I'd really hate it if they killed off his wife just to pair them up again.

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My best case dream scenario would be if Lightning Lad shows up and it turns out that he was falsely presumed dead and that means that any Mon-El/Imra marriage is invalid. They would still have to deal with the fallout but at least the marriage aspect wouldn't be a factor anymore. 

Edited by tofutan.
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On 11/21/2017 at 6:55 PM, Trini said:

James hasn't started anything with Lena - yet; you have an opportunity here, Kara!

She almost caught him bedding down for the night under Cat's desk, so who knows what might have ensued!  :D

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13 minutes ago, tofutan said:

But as you admit yourself, he DID have screentime. And why is it actually a good thing that he wasn't propping Kara, but instead he was talking about his own problems? Most fans of a character want them to get a storyline of their own rather than propping other characters. 

I really, really, really doubt that James had more screentime this season than he had last season during Guardian. Just because it's not the kind of screentime you enjoy doesn't mean that it's not screentime. And the treatment of James at CatCo has been awful. He wasn't allowed to talk to anybody about his supposed feelings for Lena. They gave him scenes with no follow up, like him reacting to Lena buying CatCo. 

IMO it's very telling that the writers still have zero interest in James at CatCo based on the fact that they started off the romance with Lena NOT by let's say them bonding over uncovering a cool lead on a story or by maybe her admiring one of his photographs. Instead it's him pulling out the Guardian again this season. It's pretty clear that the writers still consider James at CatCo useless because when they try to raise his prestige to be able to date Lena they reach back to Guardian rather than having them bond over CatCo related stuff. Because to them action!James has value while CatCo!James doesn't. 

I think the writers never really cared about CatCo or journalism. They just liked Cat. THE season where CatCo was actually important Kara wasn't actually a journalist. Even Kara doesn't actually care about journalism, she spent a season at CatCo as an assisstent and then Cat had to force her to pick a real job and even then Kara didn't know what to actually pick. And of course all the times where she quits it or gets fired. 

The show never cared about journalism and hence Kara doesn't actually care about journalism and hence doesn't actually care about CatCo. 

IMO what they should have done this season is introduce another female mentor character. Not one who is just like Cat to replace her. But just somebody to serve a comparable role while being very different in personality. 

Per your first point about James, he had SOME screentime (let me correct myself from what I said earlier!). However, look at how many episodes he missed in season 2. He was in 17 episodes out of 22. Which, if you think about it, wasn't a whole lot. However, then looking at how much screentime he got in those 17 episodes, they were sometimes reduced to just one scene and one or two lines. That's not exactly screentime in the sense that it develops him as a character. Yes, he had two centric episodes last season. But the other 15 episodes? His relationship with Kara wasn't really there. When Clark was in the first two episodes, James didn't really get to interact with him, even though he had history with Superman long before Supergirl. His episode 5 centric episode was poorly written. Then his Guardian arc made James look not just reckless, but very selfish. Also, the time was dedicated more toward Winn. How Winn felt about going out to fight crime. How Winn felt guilty about not telling Kara. James was 100% poorly mishandled in season 2. This season, he's allowed more nuance, to not just be out fighting crime, but getting to know James as a person. 

As for his relationship with Lena, it's not written great, but they're doing a better job with him than last season. Mostly, I think James/Kara's friendship is finally brought back up. That's the one thing that has worked well. 

Sometimes, though, James only appeared as Guardian last season. Which, sure, is still him appearing, but it didn't do much to elevate his character. Comparing that to season 1 James, of course, Season 2 James got shit on. Again, because he wasn't Kara's love interest anymore, they didn't seem to care to dedicate time with him. They threw in a half-assed Guardian arc, which ended up giving Winn more development, and they didn't care to have him interact with anyone other than Winn. Season 2 was just a mess, though, because of how separated all the characters really were from each other. Kara had Mon-El, Alex had her Maggie/coming out arc, Winn had Lyra and James, James had Winn, and J'onn...appeared sometimes? Which is why season 3 has done a better job at balancing the various relationships. Season 1 had good character relationships. Kara had people supporting her, but she also supported the other characters like Alex, Winn, and J'onn. 

Season 3 James at least has scenes with Kara again and not once every tenth episode. That is what I'm praising this season for. It's given Kara/James their friendship back. Now, if they could only do the same with Winn/Kara. 

Also, a female mentor character would have been great. There's a reason why Snapper Carr didn't work out (but, like you said, also because they didn't care enough about the journalism aspect). Last season was all about starting storylines and either dropping them or not caring enough to put the effort in to develop them. Kara was only a journalist when the plot of the week demanded it. James was allowed to interact with people when they could think of something for him to do (there were so many missed opportunities that could have had James in). 

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Do people really think that James/Lena is rushed? I think they've actually played it pretty tame so far. Lena's been on the show since last season; they started hinting at their attraction for each other since the Season 3 premiere; and now in episode 9, there was the mutual acknowledgment of that attraction with the kiss. They're both good-looking, high-powered executives; I'm interested in seeing how this plays out.

I wish they'd flesh out James more, though.

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15 hours ago, Trini said:

Do people really think that James/Lena is rushed? I think they've actually played it pretty tame so far. Lena's been on the show since last season; they started hinting at their attraction for each other since the Season 3 premiere; and now in episode 9, there was the mutual acknowledgment of that attraction with the kiss. They're both good-looking, high-powered executives; I'm interested in seeing how this plays out.

Yes, they're both good-looking, high-powered executives, but they're not equals.  She's still his boss, so any romantic escapades would be potentially dangerous for her if the relationship ended up going south.  And given the current cultural landscape in Hollywood and elsewhere, I wouldn't be surprised to see the show go there via something like this.

But even if the relationship did grow into a permanent one, there's also the danger of her being perceived as less than impartial if she appears to show him too much favor in the workplace because of her feelings towards him.  There's a reason that most companies generally frown on relationships between supervisors and subordinates.

Edited by legaleagle53.
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Lena might be higher on the hierarchy (that will probably never be clarified ::sigh::) but I don't think supervisor/subordinate is the relationship. Or the owner/CEO relationship shouldn't be... but TV.

If anything, I think it'll be messy on James side.

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Kara's love life

I continue to be confused by how this Kara/Mon-El/Imra thing (I even hesitate to call it a triangle really) is playing out. Mon-El/Imra just feels very underplayed for me. Which is okay, she's a new character, I doubt lot of people are dying to hear about her feelings. But why even raise the spectre of a triangle with things like Mon-El not giving back the necklace Kara gave him if we are not supposed to wonder? 

It makes some sense to underplay it if a lot of people get upset if there is too much "relationship stuff" on a superhero show but it's not like it isn't there and like it isn't consuming screentime. It's just not being played out with a lot of emotion. Mon-El doesn't indicate to what extent he still has feelings for Kara. Imra doesn't the traditional showing of either being intimdated or being confident about the shadow of Mon-El's ex. It just plays out very weird on screen. 

Alex' love life

I wonder if Alex will get a new girlfriend any time soon. It seems like kind of a clichee that once a lesbian gets put with a child her love life dies. I'm glad they had her have this dalliance with Sara, but I find it increasingly hard to picture what kind of relationship or woman they would put her with next, if they are not gonna bring back Maggie. 

I'd love a storyline where a woman flirts with her and Alex gets all flustered. Maybe some other DEO agent could ask her out now that she's single? 

James love life

James and Lena are confusing to me. Do the writers really care about this relationship at all or is it just busywork to have something for the characters to do? I think there is story potential there if the writers let them actually bond and share with each other what they are going through, but considering how little we saw of this before they got together, what really are the chances? I almost wish they would have written James and Lena intentionally as an out of the blue one night stand (like maybe they get locked in together somewhere and then something happens). 

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10 hours ago, tinnefoil said:

It makes some sense to underplay it if a lot of people get upset if there is too much "relationship stuff" on a superhero show but it's not like it isn't there and like it isn't consuming screentime. It's just not being played out with a lot of emotion. Mon-El doesn't indicate to what extent he still has feelings for Kara. Imra doesn't the traditional showing of either being intimdated or being confident about the shadow of Mon-El's ex. It just plays out very weird on screen. 

I think they're deliberately trying to emphasize the weirdness of the situation, tbh.  It's like in S2 when they went all-in on the idea of the Danvers sisters losing themselves in their respective new relationships and not spending as much time together.

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I don't think that that was intentional. I believe there was a writer interview that said it wasn't intentional that there were less sister scenes. I don't think that they were losing themselves, they were branching out. For both of them it was a big step to have their first real relationship and they kept in communication about it and talked about it. I think that would be a pretty shitty message to send that having a relationship automatically means losing yourself. I think both relationships stressed that it brought Kara and Alex a lot of happiness and healing for Alex. 

If they wanted to stress the weirdness of the situation why not just have outside characters do more to stress the weirdness? I think the writers were serious abot their "three good people in a bad situation", but is that really coming across on screen? I just thinking if they wanted me to feel that they would show us a bit more about how let's say Saturngirl is also suffering under the situation. I don't know maybe the actress is just really bland but to me that doesn't come across at all. She just seems way too chipper about everything. 

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This is random, and comes from someone who hasn't this season, but has the issue of James/Kara come up either on the show or in the media? I was just randomly thinking about that today (my brain is suuuper random) and it's still a bit astonishing they dropped a season's worth of build between of an interracial pairing for the first white guy (who was a frat slave owning douche in s2) and also tried to retcon it as Kara never having feelings for James. And the main thing is (from my experience in following the show in s1-2) how they were able to get away with it. Like nobody seriously called them out like they did with Jeremy Jordan's comments at SDCC last July. Astonishing

/random post and mini rant. 

Edited by wingster55.
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59 minutes ago, wingster55 said:

This is random, and comes from someone who hasn't this season, but has the issue of James/Kara come up either on the show or in the media?

Well, in episode 10 this season there was a line about how Kara and James "used to date" -- which is not true (I wish!) -- otherwise, their mutual attraction was still being treated as if it never existed. Can't say about in the media; I'm sure it was noticed, but I'm not sure there were enough people who felt strongly enough about it.

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There was someone who asked the showrunners about it at SDCC. They pointed out the issue of replacing their black love interest with a white guy who used to own slaves. Their reply was "This is a TV show and we want drama, James and Kara are both good hearted people so we felt we had to put her with a bad boy" or something along the lines.

The media are so gross when it comes to interracial couples. A TV Guide reporter called James a "predator". Are we watching the same show? And I didn't even ship them. I don't think Kara has much chemistry with any of her male love interests or potential love interests. I feel more with Kara and Lena than with Kara and [insert any male love interest here].

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13 hours ago, Starry said:

There was someone who asked the showrunners about it at SDCC. They pointed out the issue of replacing their black love interest with a white guy who used to own slaves. Their reply was "This is a TV show and we want drama, James and Kara are both good hearted people so we felt we had to put her with a bad boy" or something along the lines.

Do you remember where this was? A panel or an interview? I'll look myself too. 

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The thing is, this is a different answer than what Kriesberg gave at the start of Season 2.

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I wasn't sure about bringing them bringing in J'onn's father, but I'm glad that David Harewood has gotten a bit more to do.

The Alex/J'onn father/daughter scenes have been good; but it just makes me think of the whole Cadmus/Jeremiah arc that was dropped. Really hope they can get Dean Cain to commit for at least half a season.

So they've rebooted and apologized for Mon-El, so I guess Karamel is coming back around soon. Sure.

Wish there was more Lena/James; but I suspect there might be soon with Lena now directly connected to the Reign arc.

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Well, at least one couple is gettin' any:

tumblr_p8rrq152Bd1wa0ahso4_r1_500.gif

 

As for the Kara/Mon-El/Imra triangle (that was actually mainly two-sided), wow. Even though I was expecting them to give Mon-El an easy 'out' of his marriage, I was NOT expecting the easiest of outs with Imra being super cool with her husband going back to his ex.

Edited by Trini. Reason: oops dropped "not"
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Wow, they are really committed to this Kara/Lena/Supergirl triangle, aren't they? I can only assume it's so they can have DRAMA when Lena finally finds out about the secret identity. Do we think it's going to happen this season (at the end?) or the next?

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On 5/19/2018 at 11:47 PM, Trini said:

Well, at least one couple is gettin' any:

tumblr_p8rrq152Bd1wa0ahso4_r1_500.gif

 

As for the Kara/Mon-El/Imra triangle (that was actually mainly two-sided), wow. Even though I was expecting them to give Mon-El an easy 'out' of his marriage, I was NOT expecting the easiest of outs with Imra being super cool with her husband going back to his ex.

Well, considering that by the time Imra returns to the 31st Century alone, both Mon-El and Kara will have been dead from her perspective for about 1,000 years, it's not that hard to believe that she'd accept it.  She knows that Mon-El belongs in his own time, and she's not going to stand in the way of history.  Besides, she'll find her REAL soulmate in Lightning Lad.

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22 hours ago, legaleagle53 said:

Well, considering that by the time Imra returns to the 31st Century alone, both Mon-El and Kara will have been dead from her perspective for about 1,000 years, it's not that hard to believe that she'd accept it.  She knows that Mon-El belongs in his own time, and she's not going to stand in the way of history.  Besides, she'll find her REAL soulmate in Lightning Lad.

But they are MARRIED. So unless that means nothing in the 31st century, it's not a good look for either of them. But they didn't put much effort into establishing the Mon-El/Imra relationship; they should have, if they wanted some real conflict for Mon-El. Now I wonder why they bothered with having Mon-El be married at all.

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22 hours ago, Trini said:

But they are MARRIED. So unless that means nothing in the 31st century, it's not a good look for either of them. But they didn't put much effort into establishing the Mon-El/Imra relationship; they should have, if they wanted some real conflict for Mon-El. Now I wonder why they bothered with having Mon-El be married at all.

Yes, they're married as long as they're together in the same era, but from her perspective in her own time, she's been his widow now for about a full millennium, and from his in 2018, she won't even be born -- much less of an age to be legally married to him -- until long after he's dead.  As long as he stays in 2018 and she stays in 3018, there's no problem.  If he and Kara somehow travel to 3018 or Imra returns to 2018, then there's a problem, and the marriage will have to be annulled (or he and Imra will have to divorce) before he can really be free to move forward with Kara -- assuming that Kara doesn't get involved with Brainiac 5 in the meantime (which is supposed to be HER canon pairing, according to the comics).

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Nah. They're presently married whichever timeline either of them are in. I knew there wasn't going to be a good solution when they introduced this arc.

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So unless they introduce someone new, (possible?) there's the possibility of a Kara/Brainy pairing. Before, I would have thought they wouldn't, since there's been no hints/lead up to that; but the show has made several abrupt swerves when it comes to relationships. If they do try it, I'm expecting a literal personality transplant for Brainy.

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3 hours ago, Trini said:

So unless they introduce someone new, (possible?) there's the possibility of a Kara/Brainy pairing. Before, I would have thought they wouldn't, since there's been no hints/lead up to that; but the show has made several abrupt swerves when it comes to relationships. If they do try it, I'm expecting a literal personality transplant for Brainy.

I'd be more surprised if they DIDN'T go there, since Brainy and Kara are a canon couple in the comics, or at least they were all through the Silver Age.

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On 13/07/2018 at 12:57 AM, Trini said:

, I'm expecting a literal personality transplant for Brainy.

Too funny

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Well, looks like they're going with Nia/Brainy rather than Kara/Brainy. No personality transplant; but they are making an effort to show Brainy as less robotic and more human. Which is good, whether he's in a romantic relationship or not.

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I'm sad about James and Lena at odds, but we knew this was coming. ?

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