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I am disappointed that the Panthers and Browns lost today. The Panther are in trouble and may have lost their chance at a playoff spot. I had thought that last week that maybe they could still make it.  But it looks like that chance is becoming further out of reach with today's fourth straight loss.

Baker and the Browns had a very rough 1st half today, (Baker had 3INTS), but I was glad that they played much better in the 2nd half. I thought that Baker did a nice job of recovering from his poor first half, but unfortunately it wasn't enough to overcome the deficit the Browns had. Hopefully, they will learn from this experience and play better next week and beyond. 

I think it was a rough day in general for teams who are trying to sneak into the playoffs/holding onto the thread for a playoff spot. Teams like the Packers, Colts, Panthers saw their playoff chances further diminish, and in some cases almost be erased. The Rams on the OTOH keep rolling and won the NFC West Division leader title. They are the first team to clinch a playoff spot for this season.

Edited by Jx223.
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Lucky for Odell, the Giants somehow won in Overtime. They really tried to give that game away today. 

Edited by Magog.
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Damn, Arizona just got disrespected: Mike Tirico just announced the Packers have fired Mike McCarthy. Apparently, losing to the Cardinals is a bridge too far.
 

Edited by AimingforYoko.
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As far as I can tell, the only requirement is that the next coach is named Mike (Holmgren, Sherman, McCarthy).

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51 minutes ago, AimingforYoko said:

Damn, Arizona just got disrespected: Mike Tirico just announced the Packers have fired Mike McCarthy. Apparently, losing to the Cardinals is a bridge too far.
 

This was the Cardinals' last victory in Green Bay:

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Not surprised McCarthy got fired, but really surprised they fired him in-season. And they let him do his post-game presser before telling him he was canned!  The Packers were terrible today - a 13 point favorite and they played sloppy, undisciplined, and inept football.  I know the national sports talk will be that Aaron Rodgers got McCarthy fired, and that might be a small part of what happened today, but they are forgetting McCarthy's multiple failings as a coach on the field.  Forgetting about the run, stubbornly sticking with certain players when others are performing better (see earlier this year, staying with Ty Montgomery as the starting RB when Aaron Jones was clearly better, as a prime example), his inability to effectively use timeouts, his horrible decision making about when to challenge a play, and on and on.  Packer fans have been frustrated with McCarthy as a head coach for a while.  

I wonder whether they go with an offensive guy or a defensive guy.  The Packers need a lot of help on offense - a right tackle, 1 or 2 guards, a tight end, a kick returner - and on defense, they need a pass rusher or two, some linebackers who can tackle, a safety, and corners that can stay healthy.  Ted Thompson left this roster with a lot of holes (look at his last few drafts and see how many guys are still on the team or even in the NFL), but Gutekunst had a good first draft this year and seemed willing to be a player in the FA market, something Ted did very rarely. 

I wouldn't be surprised to see McCarthy end up in Cleveland.  Lots of former Green Bay guys in that head office.  

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Wow.  I am incredibly slow on the uptake because I JUST realized that I can no longer accurately sing “San Diego super Chargers!” and that makes me sad.  And I don’t even LIKE the Chargers.

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30 minutes ago, Calvada said:

I know the national sports talk will be that Aaron Rodgers got McCarthy fired, and that might be a small part of what happened today, but they are forgetting McCarthy's multiple failings as a coach on the field.  Forgetting about the run, stubbornly sticking with certain players when others are performing better (see earlier this year, staying with Ty Montgomery as the starting RB when Aaron Jones was clearly better, as a prime example), his inability to effectively use timeouts, his horrible decision making about when to challenge a play, and on and on.  Packer fans have been frustrated with McCarthy as a head coach for a while.  

I think the thing about the national media vs. Packers fans is that they have different perspectives. I'd say fans take a micro view. Things like weird challenges and time outs have gotten under the skins of Packers fans even when the Packers were playing well. (People were calling for his firing the year they won the Superbowl.)  It's why, even though I'd consider myself a Packers fan, I've long been fed up with a certain vocal section of the fan base. 

The national media, on the other hand, is probably going to take a more macro view. They aren't going to obsess over challenges that didn't go the team's way or wasted time outs.  What they see is a coach who has the best winning percentage in the NFC, a streak of 8 playoff appearances and a Superbowl win.

This season the team is undisciplined and doesn't really seem to be giving it their all.  That's in contrast with previous seasons which is probably the biggest reason why a change was on the horizon.    I do think Rodgers is a big part of that..  He is a team leader.  Yet this season, he has played lackadaisically for stretches, and has stepped up his passive aggressive shots at his head coach that weren't unheard of in the past but were more common now. I think the team followed his lead.

But I do think the issues go beyond the coach.  It probably started when the team President decided to retain the rights to hire/fire the coach even while naming a GM.  So is he going to hire the next coach?   I also don't think the way this went down was a good look.  Firing a coach, with a Superbowl ring (only the second time in history that has been done), on a Sunday after a game feels reactionary and isn't a great look.

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As much as I'm saddened to see Mike McCarthy get fired, I'm not.  I'm neutral; Dungy said it was wrong to do it to that man mid-season, but when you lose to a team at home that's going nowhere it's probably in the teams best interest to move on.  He wasn't returning anyway, and now Mike can get a head start while Green Bay can start a month early looking for their new coach.

Personally, I see it as Les Miles getting canned.  Both teams were great but couldn't overcome what it took to persevere (despite doing so previously) LSU couldn't beat Alabama, and Green Bay failed to succeed in the postseason with the second best QB behind Brady.  Didn't help that Tom, Bill, and New England wound up defeating both teams that denied the Packers of a Super Bowl berth and then finally defeated the Packers with Aaron starting.

I wish McCarthy the best, and hopefully Aaron and the Packers can find some success in the couple of years left before it's all over

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2 hours ago, Carey said:

but when you lose to a team at home that's going nowhere it's probably in the teams best interest to move on.  He wasn't returning anyway, and now Mike can get a head start while Green Bay can start a month early looking for their new coach.

Except it really doesn't do much for the team unless they want to test out Joe Philbin as a potential HC--and I don't think they do.  They can't really interview anyone until after the season is over, or even longer if teams go deep.  (Unless they want to limit all their interviews to college guys.)

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Pittsburgh.  I only ever root for you under a very specific set of circumstances.  What the hell.

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1 hour ago, mojoween said:

Pittsburgh.  I only ever root for you under a very specific set of circumstances.  What the hell.

My questions exactly.    They have never lost at home before when leading by 14 or more points.   Until last night.   Something is very wrong with this team.   Those STUPID defensive penalties at the end that basically gave the chargers a chip shot to win the game?   This is not all offense and it is not because Le'Veon Bell didn't show up.   

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Didn't stay up to see the end of last night's game.  Was shocked to see that the Chargers finally got a game-winning field goal from one of their kickers.

Then I saw that he had three shots at it.  And it all made sense.

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11 hours ago, Irlandesa said:

I think the thing about the national media vs. Packers fans is that they have different perspectives. I'd say fans take a micro view. Things like weird challenges and time outs have gotten under the skins of Packers fans even when the Packers were playing well. (People were calling for his firing the year they won the Superbowl.)  It's why, even though I'd consider myself a Packers fan, I've long been fed up with a certain vocal section of the fan base. 

The national media, on the other hand, is probably going to take a more macro view. They aren't going to obsess over challenges that didn't go the team's way or wasted time outs.  What they see is a coach who has the best winning percentage in the NFC, a streak of 8 playoff appearances and a Superbowl win.

This season the team is undisciplined and doesn't really seem to be giving it their all.  That's in contrast with previous seasons which is probably the biggest reason why a change was on the horizon.    I do think Rodgers is a big part of that..  He is a team leader.  Yet this season, he has played lackadaisically for stretches, and has stepped up his passive aggressive shots at his head coach that weren't unheard of in the past but were more common now. I think the team followed his lead.

But I do think the issues go beyond the coach.  It probably started when the team President decided to retain the rights to hire/fire the coach even while naming a GM.  So is he going to hire the next coach?   I also don't think the way this went down was a good look.  Firing a coach, with a Superbowl ring (only the second time in history that has been done), on a Sunday after a game feels reactionary and isn't a great look.

I guess that's the difference between watching every game the Packers play, sometimes twice (!) and just being aware of the team's overall record as most fans are.  They have been able to overcome a lot of issues within games due to the quality of their teams.  But it doesn't erase the fact that McCarthy was not the best game manager.  Rodgers has regressed in the past couple years, I think primarily due to injuries.  For the first half of this season, he couldn't practice, and it's nonsense to talk about how a QB with his experience does not need to practice, especially when they're breaking in 3 rookie WRs.  I think next year, if they shore up their offensive line (WAY overlooked in past 2 years by both Ted T and Gutekunst), and get a tight end, offensively they will be in good shape.  On defense, they need to find some way to get pressure on QBs, and a safety who is not constantly out of position.  I think the Packers job is an appealing one for coaching candidates, just because it's not a team that needs a total overhaul.

I totally disagree with Dungy and others (coaches, current or otherwise, will always side with a coach) that say this was terrible to do this mid-season.  McCarthy told a reporter yesterday he expected to be fired at the end of the season, so why have a dead man walking for the next month?  All he and the players would have been getting would be questions about it.  If anything, it's unfair to other coaching candidates because he gets an early start on applying for his next job.  

I think the way Mark Murphy set it up, so that he has control over the head coach hire, is goofy.  But I think it's a reflection of his unhappiness with Ted Thompson in his last couple years.

Watching ESPN right now - Rex Ryan just said it's probably time for the Bengals to move on from Marvin Lewis.  I'm waiting for the national outrage on this . . .

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11 hours ago, Irlandesa said:

I think the thing about the national media vs. Packers fans is that they have different perspectives. I'd say fans take a micro view. Things like weird challenges and time outs have gotten under the skins of Packers fans even when the Packers were playing well. (People were calling for his firing the year they won the Superbowl.)  It's why, even though I'd consider myself a Packers fan, I've long been fed up with a certain vocal section of the fan base. 

The national media, on the other hand, is probably going to take a more macro view. They aren't going to obsess over challenges that didn't go the team's way or wasted time outs.  What they see is a coach who has the best winning percentage in the NFC, a streak of 8 playoff appearances and a Superbowl win.

This season the team is undisciplined and doesn't really seem to be giving it their all.  That's in contrast with previous seasons which is probably the biggest reason why a change was on the horizon.    I do think Rodgers is a big part of that..  He is a team leader.  Yet this season, he has played lackadaisically for stretches, and has stepped up his passive aggressive shots at his head coach that weren't unheard of in the past but were more common now. I think the team followed his lead.

But I do think the issues go beyond the coach.  It probably started when the team President decided to retain the rights to hire/fire the coach even while naming a GM.  So is he going to hire the next coach?   I also don't think the way this went down was a good look.  Firing a coach, with a Superbowl ring (only the second time in history that has been done), on a Sunday after a game feels reactionary and isn't a great look.

Fair or not, I don't think the national media hold McCarthy in very high regard. Average at best is my feeling. I mean, if the Jets move on from Bowles and hire McCarthy they'd throw a party but I don't think he's seen on the level of a Sean Peyton, Andy Reid, Harbaugh, or Belichick.

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McCarthy, fairly or not, will always be seen as the guy who had Favre and Rodgers, two of the better QBs of the past 25 years, and managed to win 1 Super Bowl only.  

I'm not sure I would include Reid on that list - not winning a SB is a big shadow on any NFL coach's resume.  

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I am surprised McCarthy lasted this long. 

But also surprised they fired him mid season.  I don't think that is a wrong decision, just a surprising one.

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57 minutes ago, Calvada said:

I think the way Mark Murphy set it up, so that he has control over the head coach hire, is goofy.  But I think it's a reflection of his unhappiness with Ted Thompson in his last couple years.

But he was Ted's boss.  If he was unhappy with Thompson, he was the only one with any power to do anything about it.  Instead, he was about to hire the person who is rumored to have made some of the personnel decisions about letting some good defensive players go until it got through the grapevine that the move woudn't make many people happy.

44 minutes ago, Fukui San said:

Fair or not, I don't think the national media hold McCarthy in very high regard. Average at best is my feeling. I mean, if the Jets move on from Bowles and hire McCarthy they'd throw a party but I don't think he's seen on the level of a Sean Peyton, Andy Reid, Harbaugh, or Belichick.

I think for the media there's Belichick and the flavor of the month.

32 minutes ago, Calvada said:

McCarthy, fairly or not, will always be seen as the guy who had Favre and Rodgers, two of the better QBs of the past 25 years, and managed to win 1 Super Bowl only.

If the next coach comes in and they go on a Superbowl run?  Probably.  If they don't---then he'll probably be held in higher regard in hindsight.  I also think this depends on what McCarthy does in his next job. 

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In other news, I didn't watch Chargers at Steelers, because I was so disappointed that Melvin Gordon wasn't playing.  As a Wisconsin Badgers fan, I've been following his pro career, but haven't had much of a chance to see him play.  Chargers games are usually not shown in Wisconsin!  Anyway, Watt vs. Watt didn't have the same appeal for me, so I opted out, but it sounds like an entertaining finish and now I wish I'd stayed up to see it.  

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Regarding kickers, I admittedly know nothing about pro football and even less about college football, but in college games I've watched in the past few weeks, an awful lot of kicks are missed.   If college is your minor leagues, that is why the pro kickers are missing.  Your pantry is infected with doinks and whoopsies.  Maybe that's why they're importing rugby players.

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4 minutes ago, basiltherat said:

Regarding kickers, I admittedly know nothing about pro football and even less about college football, but in college games I've watched in the past few weeks, an awful lot of kicks are missed.   If college is your minor leagues, that is why the pro kickers are missing.  Your pantry is infected with doinks and whoopsies.  Maybe that's why they're importing rugby players.

It used to be the same with punters.  I remember when the Packers let Craig Hentrich get away in free agency (something Ron Wolf admitted was one of his biggest mistakes) and they spent a few years trying to find a replacement.  I kept thinking, geez, every college team has a punter and they can't find one guy who can do this?  But then I'd watch a few college games, see shanks, lots of 29-yard punts, and realize why.  

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Wow - Redskins QBs and their legs are cursed this season.  I was watching college basketball and during TOs catching highlights of MNF online and saw McCoy struggling up the tunnel to the locker room.  Now ESPN is reporting he broke his fibula.  Couldn't they cart him to the locker room?

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1 hour ago, Calvada said:

Wow - Redskins QBs and their legs are cursed this season.  I was watching college basketball and during TOs catching highlights of MNF online and saw McCoy struggling up the tunnel to the locker room.  Now ESPN is reporting he broke his fibula.  Couldn't they cart him to the locker room?

God is telling them to sign Kaepernick.

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6 hours ago, Silver Raven said:

God is telling them to sign Kaepernick.

After the fiasco of the signing of Reuben Foster, they NEED to do this.   But they won't.   DV is juuuuust fine.   After all they talked to the fine cops down in Tampa and felt there was no real problem.   Except this guy KEEPS getting accused by the same woman.   Which if she is lying to just get him in trouble says a LOT about his judgment by continuing to be around her.   If she is not lying, it says a lot about him as a human being.   Either way not someone you want on your team.

 

They are calling the usual suspects for tryouts -- Kellen Clemens, EJ Manuel, etc.   

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8 hours ago, Silver Raven said:

God is telling them to sign Kaepernick.

I'm confident that Dan Snyder would tell God no.

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46 minutes ago, xaxat said:
9 hours ago, Silver Raven said:

God is telling them to sign Kaepernick.

I'm confident that Dan Snyder would tell God no.

I want Colin Kaepernick to be a quarterback in the NFL again. But, I don't want him associating himself with a brain dead, scummy owner like Daniel Snyder. 

 The Redskins & (especially) Dan Snyder can get bent. I'm surprised that people haven't gotten on them yet for them being a long time (1991) since that have won the Super Bowl like they do to those Cowboys on a daily basis.

Edited by Magog.
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21 hours ago, basiltherat said:

Regarding kickers, I admittedly know nothing about pro football and even less about college football, but in college games I've watched in the past few weeks, an awful lot of kicks are missed.   If college is your minor leagues, that is why the pro kickers are missing.  Your pantry is infected with doinks and whoopsies.  Maybe that's why they're importing rugby players.

There is a huge difference between kickers at the college and pro level. 

No college kick is "easy" or a chip, gimme, whatever you want to call it.  Not just because of he kickers, but more likely I think to be blocked, flubbed up snaps, etc. 

And much that is just time.  Kickers in the NFL, they do this one thing all day, every day.  College kickers, they have a strong leg, but they aren't putting in the time the pro kickers do. 

Second allegation now about Hunt, punched a man a month before the event seen on tape :

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2018/12/02/report-nfl-investigating-second-incident-in-which-kareem-hunt-punched-a-man/

One incident, where the woman was acting a bit crazy, admittedly, its not justified what he did, but you could at least understand how he might have reacted that way even though he should not have

Now a second incident, just a month before..........seems he is the common thread. 

No one picked him up, passed waivers, not surprising.

Redskins president says he has no interest in Kaepernick

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/redskins-president-reportedly-not-interested-in-kaeperick-as-team-brings-in-sanchez-manuel-and-yates/

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23 minutes ago, DrSpaceman73 said:

NFL told the Chiefs not to pursue the Kareem Hunt video :

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2018/12/02/report-nfl-told-chiefs-to-stop-pursuing-kareem-hunt-video/

Brilliant!!!  They literally learned nothing from the Ray Rice incident

Good thing the commissioner is out front on this issue! Publicly explaining through multiple outlets how the league goes about judging accusations of assault or abuse and why Hunt was suspended only after TMZ released the tape. 

(Must be nice to get forty million a year to hide in a Park Avenue office.)

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The way the article was written makes it sound like a clusterfuck on all levels, not just the NFL.  And I believe the NFL should not get into the policy of paying for videos like TMZ does.

And I am not saying anything against or for anyone here, how anyone feels is their business and should not be judged, but I don’t understand why I, as a fan, should care how the NFL handles shit like this.  I fail to see how it affects me.

I am open to explanations from any corner, but what Kareem Hunt did and what the NFL failed to do about it didn’t change how I felt about the Giants game on Sunday.  And I’m not certain that it should.

Obviously Kareem is a shit and I feel badly for the woman, no one should be treated like that ever, I mean people really need to stop being shits to each other everywhere.

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Molly Qarem (sp?) on First Take was visibly emotional on the NFL yesterday, and both Stephen A & Max seemed to think (at least initially) that she was placing the blame w/the NFL, instead of Kareem.

She was saying how upset & dismayed at the NFL she was that they never even bothered to see if there was a tape (duh...hotel) and they never even interviewed Karem or the Woman!  How is that even possible?

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And I am not saying anything against or for anyone here, how anyone feels is their business and should not be judged, but I don’t understand why I, as a fan, should care how the NFL handles shit like this.  I fail to see how it affects me.

I am open to explanations from any corner, but what Kareem Hunt did and what the NFL failed to do about it didn’t change how I felt about the Giants game on Sunday.  And I’m not certain that it should.

Obviously I can only speak for myself here, but what I find particularly galling is the NFL's hypocrisy. There's so much rhetoric about holding players accountable and how the league really cares about domestic violence, really, and they're going to be tough about it...except they only care when TMZ leaks a video and they'll look bad if they don't take swift public action. And shhhh, they're going to try hard to look the other way if you're an even mediocre player. If the NFL really truly doesn't care about domestic violence? It should just say that instead of trying to convince us that it does--or at least just don't talk about it!, instead of talking like you're a tough guy and then totally failing to follow through on anything you've threatened. The NFL's domestic violence "policy" is becoming symbolic of the cultural zeitgeist, insofar as it emblematizes just how many men don't actually care about women even as they claim to.

And again this is imo, but I think it's utterly ridiculous that the NFL worked 1000 times harder on Deflategate (and produced, at the end of the day, a sham report full of BS science that multiple scientists have discredited) than any of these investigations. I also think it's utterly ridiculous that the league has been/is way more concerned about stopping peaceful anthem protests than the off-the-field violence their players perpetrate. It's the utterly skewed priorities that does it for me.

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13 hours ago, xaxat said:

I'm confident that Dan Snyder would tell God no.

I'm confident that Dan Snyder thinks he is God.  .

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1 hour ago, stealinghome said:

Obviously I can only speak for myself here, but what I find particularly galling is the NFL's hypocrisy.

I think it's more that they really think they're above the law because they make 10 billion per year and due process doesn't apply. Smack around your wife, nbd, but kneel for the anthem and use your position for social change like so many other athletes before you, and you're literally ostracized. 

The NFL isn't nearly central to the fabric of American society as it thinks it is, and I so so so hope there's a lockout/strike in the next CBA and they find out for real that everyone will find something else to do on Sundays if they're not around. 

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Well as a private entity, due process doesn't apply.    However, if they are going to talk about how dedicated they are to acting, they need to really act.   They can say that the hotel wouldn't turn over the tape.   Okay fine.   But they didn't even ask the police for it through a formal records request which must be replied to in writing as to why it is not turned over, if that happens.   Since the cops declined to bring charges, there is no ongoing investigation and the tape would have been released.   Or you know, TALK to the parties involved.   Although do better than the Ray Rice interview.   Janay Rice was interviewed with RAY IN THE ROOM.   Because best practices is, OF COURSE, to ask the alleged victim about the abuse with the abuser standing RIGHT THERE.   I mean there are little things they can just get right.

But Ezekial Elliott?   Never put on the Exempt List, although he should have been.   Investigated for over a year.   The evidence was equivocal at best, suspended 6 games.   

There is no PLAN for how to do these things.    At the very least there should be.   Then let Goodell fuck it up because he didn't think the player was deferential enough or was wearing the wrong shirt or something.

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Washington is all over the map today.

First, as a neutral observer, it would probably be in their best interests to let Foster go.

Then I saw a statement on Twitter asking for privacy for Alex Smith’s family while he deals with his injury and I was like wait that happened like a month ago.  But apparently he has a pretty serious infection that needs more procedures.

I feel badly for the guy.  I wonder if this is the same type of thing Zach Smith went through.  (I think that is his name, the TE for Chicago who hurt his leg and nearly lost it)

Edited by mojoween.
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51 minutes ago, mojoween said:

Washington is all over the map today.

First, as a neutral observer, it would probably be in their best interests to let Foster go.

Then I saw a statement on Twitter asking for privacy for Alex Smith’s family while he deals with his injury and I was like wait that happened like a month ago.  But apparently he has a pretty serious infection that needs more procedures.

I feel badly for the guy.  I wonder if this is the same type of thing Zach Smith went through.  (I think that is his name, the TE for Chicago who hurt his leg and nearly lost it)

I agree, he does deserve to recover in peace, especially since this is more than just a typical injury.  Forget football, he has to make sure he isn't permanently crippled or even dies.

As for Washington the team, they're forgetting about a QB who has actually started multiple games this season and is available.  Nathan Peterman, come on down!

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Both the Titans and Jags color rush unis are great.  Especially the Titan blue.  It’s darker than one would expect but looks awesome.

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I only saw about a couple minutes of the game last night, just saw the Titans guy making that 99 yard run for the TD.  He tossed those three Jags aside like they were used kleenex.  It was sad.    

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How sad is it when the announcer says, in all seriousness, that Meyer, the Jets kicker, might win the team's offensive MVP?

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While watching the Giants/Washington puntfest my mind wandered and I was all set to blame Dan Snyder for changing the name from RFK Stadium to Fedex Field.  However some wiki-ing led me to find out that Washington left RFK before Snyder even bought the team.

It’s always a disappointment to exonerate Snyder.  Now I need to find out if the stadium name changed from Jack Kent Cooke to RFK or if Washington moved the facility.

This shit interests me for some odd reason.  Like I still call where Buffalo plays Rich Stadium even though it’s had two names since then.

Also, Mark Sanchez is faltering out there.  Too many Washington injuries.

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It’s always a disappointment to exonerate Snyder.

Can we put the blame on him for his crummy Redskins laying down & playing dead against the Giants today? 

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Now I need to find out if the stadium name changed from Jack Kent Cooke to RFK or if Washington moved the facility.

It was first called Jack Kent Cooke Stadium when the Redskins moved there in 1997. When Snyder brought the team a couple of yrs later (1999), it was changed to Fed Ex Field. Right now, he is trying to get a new stadium.

 

Hopefully, the day will get even better when the Cowboys go down against the Eagles today.

Edited by Magog.
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Not sure what I'm watching but, I'm sitting here waiting for the Giants to screw it up.

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