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Small Talk: Malicious Accusery

It would make sense that they were. The show ran around 26 minutes or so when today, they run between 20 and 22 minutes.

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Colorizing the episodes didn't do much for me, because part of the fun is the nostalgia of seeing them in black and white.

But there is a real upside to this:   CBS devoted an hour of prime time for the colorized episodes, and if that brings in more viewers who have never seen the show, then that is a good thing.

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Hulu has the entire series except season 3 episode 20 (The Brave and the Backache) available to subscribers. 

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Plot summary from IMDb:

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Since Jerry has to go to a convention, Jerry and Millie can't go to Millie's sister's cottage at Lake Sissimanounou for their planned romantic weekend getaway. The Helpers would offer the cottage to Rob and Laura, but Jerry, based on casual conversations with a psychiatrist with whom he commutes into the city, believes Rob has some psychological block in going there since he has always come down with some ailment every other time the cottage has been offered to them. Millie further believes the block has something to do with Rob not wanting to be "alone" alone with Laura. To prove them wrong, Rob agrees to go despite the effort it will take to get time off from work, but in trying as hard as he can not to get sick from Sally's head cold prior to the trip, he ends up throwing out his back. Rob begins to think that Jerry and Millie may be right, as does Laura, especially as the orthopedist can't find anything medically causing the problem. To determine if his back problem is indeed all ...

I can't say that I remember this one.

10 hours ago, Rinaldo said:

That is undoubtedly inspiring theories as to why that one exclusion.

Ha!  I've been watching Hill Street Blues on the Heroes and Icons (H&I) station, which recently skipped an episode I really wanted to see again (Frank and Joyce visit his parents and take some grief for not having kids).  AFAIK, this is the only HSB episode that H&I has omitted (at least since I've been watching -- I picked up around mid-season 4 a few months ago, and they're now finishing up season 6).

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For those interested, I saw ads for I Love Lucy and Dick Van Dyke Christmas shows for tomorrow night (Fri 12/22).  Not sure what network but I think it was one of the (formerly) big 3.

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20 hours ago, kassa said:

For those interested, I saw ads for I Love Lucy and Dick Van Dyke Christmas shows for tomorrow night (Fri 12/22).  Not sure what network but I think it was one of the (formerly) big 3.

Thanks. Checking the schedule, it's CBS.

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Maybe it will fare better than when they ILL up with the Andy Griffith Show.   I was hoping they keep doing TAGS but I assume the ratings weren't good since it was a one and done. I don't think TDVDS had a Christmas episode did it?

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50 minutes ago, Maverick said:

I don't think TDVDS had a Christmas episode did it?

They had at least one where they all (including Laura) perform on Alan Brady's show. Many musical numbers.

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Weirdly, the colorized eps do not include the Christmas one, according to my listing. It'll be "My Blonde-Haired Brunette" and "October Eve."

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Duh.  How could I forget the episode where Alan turns the show over to the staff...which apparently consists of only Rob, Sally and Buddy.    Very odd that it wasn't included.  I thought both episodes were an odd choice to pick.   I would have expected the Christmas episode and Uny Uftz,the walnut episode (even though that's not a favorite of mine) or something with a musical number.   

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4 hours ago, Maverick said:

Duh.  How could I forget the episode where Alan turns the show over to the staff...which apparently consists of only Rob, Sally and Buddy. 

And Laura apparently lol.

I agree these were odd choices for airing on Christmas.  For that matter the "Fashion Show" I Love Lucy was an odd choice too, IMO.

Maybe these just happened to be colorized so they aired them.  They're both very Laura-centric episodes also.

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10 hours ago, rmontro said:
15 hours ago, Maverick said:

Duh.  How could I forget the episode where Alan turns the show over to the staff...which apparently consists of only Rob, Sally and Buddy. 

And Laura apparently lol.

And Richie!

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1 hour ago, Nordly Beaumont said:

And Richie!

That's always been the killer for me in that episode. Bring in Laura, sure -- she has a professional performing background, more so than the three writers (though of course we know that DVD, Morey Amsterdam, and Rose Marie had their own specialties as entertainers, which we're happy to hand-wave their conflating with their characters in episodes like this... yes, Rob did do a little hoofing back in his army days). But Richie? All I can say is that "The Little Drummer Boy" was brand new, and really big, right then.

Later on, the sitcoms I watched shied away from presenting their characters as magical all-around entertainers within the story: Mary Richards teased us just once trying out with "One for My Baby," and it turned out horrifically (and hilariously) bad, and Barney Miller never offered to sing or play clarinet. But not all 70s sitcoms: I seem to remember that Benson did a Christmas-variety-show episode, and I wouldn't be surprised if one or more shows in the Facts of Life or Happy Days universes went there.

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7 hours ago, Rinaldo said:

 All I can say is that "The Little Drummer Boy" was brand new, and really big, right then.

This didn't sound right to me (I thought the song was older), so I looked it up.  It was written in 1941 by Katherine Davis, first recorded by the Von Trapp Singers in 1951, and was a hit for the Harry Simeone Chorale in 1958.  From there it mushroomed into multiple recordings by multiple artists.  The Dick Van Dyke Christmas episode was in 1963.  So while the song was popular in 1963, it wasn't really brand new.

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Thanks for the research, which I foolishly hadn't done myself. I only recalled that before the burst of recordings around 1960, nobody I knew had heard of it. That era is when it became a hit phenomenon (and it really seemed to be omnipresent, out of nowhere). I'll have to read up on it some more. I see that he Harry Simeone Chorale rendition remained high on the charts for years (presumably just seasonally), so it would still have felt current in 1963. I actually recall a solo male rendition from around then, which (looking at the alternatives Wikipedia lists) was very likely the Johnny Mathis one.

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I too wonder about the episode choice for the colorized shows.  Autumn Eve had some great lines ("why would Sally call to tell me THAT?!") and great MTM cringes, but the first one about the hair dye was about as bad as the show ever got (which was seldom).  With some exceptions, in most of the great episodes of this show you can roll your eyes at the sexism, but geez, these two were not episodes to draw in new viewers. 

And I've watched the show through syndication enough to suspect that they already were not in syndication -- is that why they were available for colorization?

Edited by kassa.
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I just figured they chose Mary centered episodes since she died this year. Carl Reiner always said that the "general yuchiness" rant really showed him that Mary was funny too. They even moved it up in the season to let the audience know how funny she could be. It's not one of my favorites, but I like it fine - except for the ridiculously wrong portrayal of how hair is dyed!

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I posted in the Celebrity Deaths thread, but had to post here, to say I feel another bit of my youth has slipped away.  TDVDS is one of my very favorite shows of all time.  I have the DVDs and watch the entire series every other year.  What a great ensemble this show had.  Very much of its time though, with the stay at home mom, and the career woman who just wants a husband.  I discovered this show in after school reruns in the 70s, and I could never understand why Sally wanted a husband.  She had an interesting job, got to work with celebrities, lived in her own apartment in New York City -- that sounded like a great life to me.  

Rose Marie had an amazing career - over 90 years in show business!  I hope she's with her beloved husband now, and cracking some jokes with Morey Amsterdam.

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 I could never understand why Sally wanted a husband.  She had an interesting job, got to work with celebrities, lived in her own apartment in New York City -- that sounded like a great life to me.

Ditto! But, at least we got the character of Sally to begin with... I'm sure it was 'cutting edge' considering it was TV in the early '60s. She made me want to be a writer. OK, so I'm an editor as it turns out, but that's close. 

You were an inspiration, Rose Marie. 

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1 hour ago, rubaco said:

Ditto! But, at least we got the character of Sally to begin with... I'm sure it was 'cutting edge' considering it was TV in the early '60s. She made me want to be a writer. OK, so I'm an editor as it turns out, but that's close. 

You were an inspiration, Rose Marie. 

Funny you should say this. From the LA Times Rose Marie obituary

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“I’ve had young girls come up to me and say, ‘It was because of you I became a writer,’” Marie said on a 2004 reunion show of the surviving cast members. “I worked with the guys, I made the same money — I was the first women’s libber on television.”

Edited by Loandbehold. Reason: Funny in the serendipity sense.
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I certainly loved her and despised MTM on the show, for those sorts of reasons. Sally Rogers was a compilation of the two women who actually worked on Sid Caesar's shows: Lucille Kallen, who also wrote for Broadway and penned a series of mystery novels under the pseudonym C.B. Greenfield, and Selma Diamond, who is also known as an actress.

Sorry to see her go.

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R.I.P. Jerry Van Dyke, Dick's brother, who played Rob's brother Stacy on a few episodes of DVDS.  Article.

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tumblr_p5kfakUqGm1qhbarso1_540.jpg

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Of the two musicals that DVD and MTM separately were in with Julie Andrews, Mary Poppins is obviously the classic, while Thoroughly Modern Millie has not aged well, cute flapper dancing aside.

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I've never seen Thoroughly Modern Millie, but I remember it getting tepid reviews at the time.  Julie Andrews is a marvelous singer, but I think her acting is weak.  I just watched Torn Curtain a few weeks ago, and how anyone can manage not to have chemistry with Paul Newman is beyond me.  Maybe it was the Hitchcock influence!

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I've been a Julie Andrews fan in my time, but I'd certainly concede that she has had her weak points as a performer (they show up most clearly in Star!Darling Lili, and her weekly variety show, all from the years around 1970). Still, I wouldn't blame her for any problems with the two films you mention. Torn Curtain seems to have been one of those projects where nothing went right; in fact, I find Hitchcock's work near-unwatchable from here on (I know others disagree).

And Thoroughly Modern Millie, of which everyone expected so much, turned out kind of a mess. Andrews did her job, but those in charge certainly didn't. Prime among them, how do you manage to hire Mary Tyler Moore, a delightful musical performer herself in that period, and then do almost nothing with her? No songs to herself, only the few seconds of dance indicated in the still just above plus a couple more in the background of a mass production number, not even the chance to be funny... and the other leading players were no better served. This movie was made by people who didn't know what they were doing, and then did it at numbing length. (I'll never forget Ethan Mordden's description of the "Jewish Wedding Song" as something that was evidently inserted into the movie "at gunpoint.")

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Given that some of the other cast members merited "RIP" posts on this thread, I'm surprised no one posted anything when Mary Tyler Moore died last year.  She was one of the show's principals and it wouldn't have been the same without her.

Edited by Bercilak.
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True, MTM made quite an impact in portraying Laura Petrie.  But since she went on to have her own show, posters seemed to congregate there when she died.

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On 05/08/2018 at 10:00 AM, Inquisitionist said:

True, MTM made quite an impact in portraying Laura Petrie.  But since she went on to have her own show, posters seemed to congregate there when she died.

I see.  Thank you for the response.  I watched this show in syndication when I was a boy 40 years ago, and I recently decided to watch it from the beginning.  I wish that these boards (or any message boards about the show) were active.  It'd be nice to exchange thoughts with other folk.

Damn you, imdb.com.  Damn you all to Hell!

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Exactly. The way to have a discussion is to start one.

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I didn't know where else to post this, but MeTV had a wonderful 2-hour biography this week on Rose Marie.  Of course, I knew she had been a child star, but there was quite a bit about her I didn't know.  Most of it was narrated by her with a few reenactments, but there was a ton of film footage of her throughout her life.  She and her husband must have brought a movie camera with them wherever they went. lol. She had a very happy marriage (20 years or so) until her husband died in his 40s.    She actually knew Al Capone, Bugsy Siegel, and other gangsters. 

Edited by Gemma Violet.
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22 minutes ago, Gemma Violet said:

I didn't know where else to post this, but MeTV had a wonderful 2-hour biography this week on Rose Marie.  Of course, I knew she had been a child star, but there was quite a bit about her I didn't know.  Most of it was narrated by her with a few reenactments, but there was a ton of film footage of her throughout her life.  She and her husband must have brought a move camera with them wherever they went. lol. She had a very happy marriage (20 years or so) until her husband died in his 40s.    She actually knew Al Capone, Bugsy Siegel, and other gangsters. 

Oh man, I had seen the commercial for that and then I forgot all about it. I'll have to keep an eye on MeTV in the hopes they show it again. I would love to see that. 

Edited to add: Never mind, I just saw that Netflix has it, so I put it into my queue! Yay.

Edited by rubaco. Reason: further research
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Watching the reruns of this show, it's easy to forget that many of the actors were already stars in their own right. Morey Amsterdam had hosted the Morey Amsterdam Show, was active in dramatic roles, and also produced several programs before joining the Dick Van Dyke Show.

Rose Marie had a successful singing career as Baby Rose Marie.

Richard Deacon was already into his career as a successful second banana, including appearances on the Jack Benny Program.

It's easy to forget this, because we don't see any big egos in the acting.  Isn't it refreshing to watch a show where the actors are more interested in a quality episode than counting how many lines they have?

Edited by TheLastKidPicked.
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I was familiar with both Dick Van Dyke and Morey Amsterdam because they were both regular presences on the "celebrities sit around in a living room and play games" shows of the 1950s. And then Mr. Van Dyke starred in Bye Bye Birdie onstage (I had the cast LP) -- they had to buy him out of his contract for the series.

1 hour ago, TheLastKidPicked said:

Isn't it refreshing to watch a show where the actors are more interested in a quality episode than counting how many lines they have?

In general, that's true, but by most accounts there was a smidgen of that coming from Rose Marie. She had signed on with the assurance that hers was the biggest female role, and "the wife" would be just an occasional brief bit. But then of course it became more and more evident what a find they had in Mary Tyler Moore (amazingly, Carl Reiner insists that they didn't know about her musical or dancing skills before hiring her, and even she may have been unaware of her comedic range), and the writers began featuring her more and more. It wasn't really a feud or anything that extreme; as Rose Marie herself put it, "We got along perfectly well... but very sparingly."

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43 minutes ago, Rinaldo said:

In general, that's true, but by most accounts there was a smidgen of that coming from Rose Marie. She had signed on with the assurance that hers was the biggest female role, and "the wife" would be just an occasional brief bit. But then of course it became more and more evident what a find they had in Mary Tyler Moore (amazingly, Carl Reiner insists that they didn't know about her musical or dancing skills before hiring her, and even she may have been unaware of her comedic range), and the writers began featuring her more and more. It wasn't really a feud or anything that extreme; as Rose Marie herself put it, "We got along perfectly well... but very sparingly."

Thank you, Rinaldo.  I didn't know that, but it makes perfect sense that since the show was to take place mostly in the office, it would be expected that Sally Rogers would be the leading female role.

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