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  1. The Flash in the Media

    The Flash Is Giving Kid Flash More To Do In Season 5 Than We Thought
  2. The LWG brought up an interesting point in the recent podcast about how POC's faces and pain are not seen or recognized. Well, there's research that this lack of empathy towards POCs even affects medical treatment. Here's a Washington Post excerpt: "Researchers at the University of Virginia quizzed white medical students and residents to see how many believed inaccurate and at times "fantastical" differences about the two races -- for example, that blacks have less sensitive nerve endings than whites or that black people's blood coagulates more quickly. They found that fully half thought at least one of the false statements presented was possibly, probably or definitely true. Moreover, those who held false beliefs often rated black patients' pain as lower than that of white patients and made less appropriate recommendations about how they should be treated." Here's a National Institutes of Health research article about it, too. About a year ago on Tumblr, I responded to a SB who detailed all the reasons she shipped Barry with Caitlin, and almost every, single thing she discussed could describe Barry and Iris. It was like she had completely ignored or blocked out Iris' experience with Barry, so she couldn't see the similarities.
  3. Another Ladies With Gumption podcast on treatment of POCs in the Arrowverse: https://www.podomatic.com/podcasts/ladieswgumption/episodes/2018-08-13T01_55_28-07_00 "The Flash" starts at 1:05:40
  4. The Flash in the Media

    Agree about the chin strap being needed. I just went to look at the 2024 newspaper article, and there's a chin strap or jaw guard on the suit in the picture for 2024. Isn't that inconsistent?
  5. Relationships: Speed Dating

    Then how in the world do they handle this in the comics with characters like Lois Lane or Iris West?
  6. Relationships: Speed Dating

    Forgive me if I've said this before, but I thought that Kendra working at Jitters, Iris' former workplace, would have been a great opportunity to have Iris befriend her. Iris could share tips about working there with her and vouch for Cisco being a good guy. A friendship could have developed between the two culminating in Vandal Savage mistakenly kidnapping Iris thinking she was Kendra or taking both when he tried to kidnap Kendra. Instead of Felicity finding old newspaper articles about Savage, Iris could have done that on the "Arrow" episode. Iris could have also helped throw the media off the scent, too, to give the teams the opportunity to take down Savage without too much scrutiny from the press or she could have spun the press coverage to their benefit. Iris could have been there as a sounding board for Fefe in the "Arrow" episode when Fefe had her massive meltdown over Oliver's secret son; Iris could certainly relate to how that feels because of Barry's secret. It's like the writers either forgot how to incorporate Iris or they were told to deliberately leave her out. Even in the S3 crossover, they had Iris basically babysitting Wally. Can it be true that they couldn't find something for Iris to contribute in those two crossovers? We've seen Iris fight and we've seen her use a fire arm, which her cop father trained her to do. We've seen her strategize and be brave and smart under pressure, but they wrote nothing for those two crossovers for the leading lady....SMH ETA: I've always thought the crossovers were a kind of mega advertising blitz for all the shows. Someone who normally doesn't watch one of the shows gets a taste of what that show is like; the goal, of course, is to pique that viewer's interest in watching that show. So, then why does it seem like the leading lady of the "Flash" doesn't get to play with the "popular kids" of the others shows much? Did the EPs think having her front and center in the crossovers wouldn't draw new viewership? It makes me wonder. The irony, of course, is that the "Flash" is the most popular show on the CW with Iris West as leading lady.
  7. The Flash in the Media

    https://youtu.be/r1Zoy5_GLKE This was one of their earliest interviews when things were presumably good between them. Notice the (perhaps inadvertent) subtle shade at minute 2:50 I mean, she could have just said that she was happy to be representing women in STEM.
  8. Relationships: Speed Dating

    This would explain why CP only had 12 words in the 2x8 episode, "Legends of Tomorrow". What a shameful use or misuse of the leading lady!
  9. Relationships: Speed Dating

    Speaking of trying to oust CP, here's a Collider interview excerpt with just AJK and DP about Cait's role in S2: Will Caitlin be stepping into more of a leadership role at S.T.A.R. Labs? PANABAKER: Absolutely! The old dynamic from Season 1 was that this was Wells’ S.T.A.R. Labs. He created it, so he was the boss and we all followed along. This year, it’s feeling a little bit different. We’re trying to figure it out. Whoever has the most expertise or passion about something tends to be the one we follow. KREISBERG: It’s a conscience effort on our part, too. The thing that Iris adds to those scenes, when she’s in them, is the heart that they don’t always have, being a bunch of scientists talking about things. But Caitlin, especially, has taken the reins, in a lot of ways.
  10. The Flash in the Media

    I agree with this, and that's why the scenes don't work between the two because they don't want it, but have to do it. However, with other females that interact with Iris, it had some sense of being genuine even though short-lived. Even Caitlin and Amunet's relationship kinda works.
  11. The Flash in the Media

    So, I did some research to find these instances you mentioned and came up with the following, which, I have to say, doesn't really have me convinced that either actress was genuinely advocating specifically for a Caitlin and Iris friendship. Seems the advocating was more for female friendships in general: WonderCon 2015 – April 3-5, 2015: https://youtu.be/M2Cgc6_LkHM Starts at minute 5:15 DP says she’s happy to be the only woman in the lab, but says that you’ll see some Iris/Caitlin interaction. This isn’t exactly advocating for a friendship. 9/21/15: https://www.themarysue.com/candice-patton-dragon-con/ Reporter: It sounds like you may be in the lab more often now? Do you get to interact with Caitlin more? Because I mean, female friendships are not something that are really on the show – it seems like it’s a boy’s club. How will your relationship with her – your friendship, develop? Patton: Yeah, I think it’s just hard when you only have 2 female characters on the show. And I think we’re remedying that this season with a lot of other female characters – Patty, and Linda Park is coming back. As far as Iris’ relationship with Caitlin, I don’t know that it’s that in-depth yet. One thing they do share in common is that – caught myself almost saying something…. [LAUGHTER] I don’t know, to answer that question. But I do know that there will be more female relationships. Iris West and Linda Park specifically have a friendship that will be prevalent in season 2, which I’m excited about. They work together, and they are both very strong willed women and they support each other. And I think that’s a great message for people to see. Reporter: Is there any relationship in particular, now that you’re a part of the team, that you’ve seen grow in season 2 and you really like? Patton: That’s a great question. [PAUSE] No. I wish I could say – I mean, I think there’s a little small dynamics between Iris and Barry – I mean Iris and Cisco and Iris and Caitlin. I find myself with them often when Barry’s off saving the world, and Iris is in the lab with Cisco and Cailtin. So there’s a little bit of banter that happens. And that’s nice. But in terms of deep, new relationships with these characters? Not so much, yet. But that doesn’t mean that that couldn’t evolve over time. 8/4/17: http://flashtvnews.com/iris-caitlin-friendship-to-develop-in-flash-season-4/29448 “We’re definitely going to see Iris’ relationship with Caitlin especially developed this season, which we haven’t seen before, which will be really nice for fans,” Candice Patton told Entertainment Weekly. “Fans have been wanting to see more female dynamic on the show, and there will definitely be that. They’re working closely together. Caitlin has been through so much herself in relationships, and I think if anyone can offer advice, it would be her, so she’s there quite often to give Iris advice on her relationship with Barry and how to move forward.” 8/23/17: https://www.ibtimes.com/flash-candice-patton-wants-malese-jow-return-linda-park-2581536 “I keep advocating for Linda Park to come back because I feel like they, of all the characters, could have a really great female friendship,” Patton said (via Comic Book Resources). “I don’t know if that’s something that’s going to happen. But we’ve got Caitlin (Danielle Panabaker), we’ve got Gypsy (Jessica Camacho), Jessie Quick (Violett Beane), who’s kind of taken off for now. … The female friendships [on the show] are kind of not as strong, but I don’t know. We’ll see. Maybe Season 4. Maybe.” Although Patton told Comic Book Resources in the same year that “there’s a friendship” between Iris and Linda, and that Iris and Patty Spivot (Shantel VanSanten) “have the potential to have a very amicable friendship,” 2/16/18: https://www.player.one/flash-season-4-danielle-panabaker-candice-patton-interview-124147 While filming Season 3, she had to give Executive Producer Todd Helbing a call. She was frustrated the plan was for Caitlin to get yet another tragic love interest instead of delving deeper into pre-existing relationships or letting the series explore the complexities of her dual identity in one strong story arc. “All of these are things I expressed for a long time. Season 3 in particular, I couldn’t believe they were giving me another love interest. I remember calling Todd Helbing and being like, ‘Are you serious? Is this what’s happening right now?’” “It’s nice to get to delve into something different, play more with the boys and do the superpowers of it all, but I do miss the relationships,” Panabaker said. “That’s what makes Flash so special, the love we all have for each other. I’d like to see them lean into that a little bit more. Caitlin and Iris, Caitlin and Wells, Caitlin and Cisco…” ETA: June 2016 SDCC: Even when asked a direct question about a Cait and Iris friendship, CP turns it into a generic or general answer about female relationships being friendly and supportive - not specifically about those two characters.
  12. The Flash in the Media

    Considering there have only been two long-standing females on the show, Iris and Caitlin alone cannot be used as evidence that the show has disinterest in female/female relationships. However, we have seen them invest a little time in Iris and Linda's relationship for the short time she was on the show. We have seen Iris and Cecile having genuine interactions, which should only improve now that she's a regular. Even Iris and Marlize have a striking and believable connection. ETA: Let's even throw in Fefe, who has a friendship with Iris that's believable (notwithstanding the wedding debaucle). And yet, we haven't seen much believable and genuine friendship between the two main females in 3+ seasons. And based on what DP said, we're not likely to see much in S5 of that friendship either. And while speculation isn't facts, it is based on evidence in the public sphere, which raises it above just gossip, which is idle talk based only on rumors.
  13. The Flash in the Media

    What strikes me as truly sad is that none of them even gave Caitlin a pity like, you know, so she wouldn't feel left out. Ouch!
  14. The Flash in the Media

    I’m actually astonished that you can continue to believe it’s just gossip after the evidence that’s been presented to us in the last few weeks. In some posts, some stated that SB wasn’t a viable option; we now know that SB was always on the table as a viable option from Grant Gustin himself. So, speculation on that has been proven true. We also have media evidence that DP and CP only tolerate each other: CP not clapping for DP, the awkward, stiff picture with them at the autograph station, DP implying that the SnoWest friendship won’t be displayed since Iris is no longer in the lab, etc . So, we have evidence that the actors real-life dynamic is “icy” (pun intended). In other posts, some have claimed the actors had no control or say in what happens to their characters. We now have evidence from their own lips that the actors do have some control. GG controlled whether SB happened. Danielle Panabaker said, “No” to a Ralph and Caitlin romance, unless you believe that Hartley Sawyer is lying. We may logically speculate that there were other instances where the actors also gave input on what happened to their characters. It also logical to assume that, of the two female actors, DP had the most influence in the first three seasons because of her connection to AJK and his wife. (Obviously, DP didn’t have more power than GG.) Therefore, if DP didn’t want a friendship between Iris and Caitlin, it didn’t happen. And there’s plenty of evidence on the show of missed opportunities to make them friends long before S4. We can no longer state with certainty that the lack of a SnoWest friendship has nothing to do with the actors’ influence, real-life animosity, or preferences. We can no longer say with certainty that those cut scenes of Iris and Caitlin hugging was just to save run time; after all, that hug would take only a few seconds to show. It’s now more likely that the SnoWest friendship happened as a result of media scrutiny and pressure to do something about this huge elephant in the room of the two females not having a real friendship for years. Ladies with Gumption (LWG) are media; they attended SDCC as members of the press. In fact, it was a member of LWG who asked Grant the question that generated the confession from Grant that he put the kibosh on SB and pushed for WestAllen. LWG talked with the cast and watched the cast interactions in person. So, if LWG are speculating that the SnoWest friendship didn’t happen because of the influence of the actors, then we cannot say that it’s just gossip.
  15. The Flash in the Media

    Ladies with Gumption podcast about female friendships in the Arrowverse: https://ladieswgumption.tumblr.com/post/176658659574/your-favorite-ladies-with-gumption Flash discussion starts at 46:37