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  1. Once Upon a Time has been one of the only shows in the last few years that I've watched weekly and that I've obsessively followed spoilers for. I really didn't have much reaction when I heard about the cancellation. I think I already mourned it when JMo left. I planned on watching season 7 at the time but figured it wouldn't be the same. As it turns out, I lost interest in season 7 really quickly--more quickly than I would have expected given that I'd been a OUAT addict since season 3. I actually stopped pretty much cold turkey, tuning in for episode 2 and the episode where Hook got Mother Gothel pregnant. I tried watching more but just couldn't get into it. I've still been checking in on these forums from time to time though, so this is definitely what I'll miss most. I've said it before, but Once will always be the show full of unreached potential for me. I fell in love with two storylines: Hook and Emma's and Rumple and Bae's. Hook and Emma got a lot of great moments, but the writers also missed so many opportunities with them. The chemistry was great and so were their backstories and how they ultimately came together, but it seemed like the writers were scared to go full force with them. We didn't even get a true love's kiss, which is mind boggling to me. Still though, the great moments are enough for me to look back on their story fondly, and maybe even enough for me to remember them as one of my all-time favorite tv couples. I know I'll probably be rewaching the Beanstalk episode, the Neverland episode, the season 3 finale, and the musical for years to come. I remember when I first got invested in Once. It was because of Emma and Hook's chemistry. I remember thinking that there's no way the writers would have their lead character end up with Captain Hook. Not only did Emma and Hook end up together, but we even got a scene of them singing to each other on their wedding day. My second favorite relationship didn't get any payoff. Usually I find familial relationships more compelling than romantic ones. Rumple and Bae were a great example of that. The actor who played Young Bae was fantastic, and I found that Rumple was at his most compelling and even sympathetic in his scenes with Young Bae. I didn't like Neal (and I really wish they hadn't made Bae Henry's father), but I also didn't like how they completely wasted the opportunity for scenes between him and Rumple. Bae was the first casualty of the writers' weaknesses. Despite all of the lost potential, this show will always hold a special place in my heart. It's just a silly show about fairy tales, but it's been a weirdly important part of my life. Like tennisgurl said, Once was there for me through college and starting grad school. It gave me something to look forward to every week. Even in its last couple of disappointing seasons, it still provided much appreciated escapism. It's the end of an era!
  2. S02.E14: Super Bowl Sunday

    I'm satisfied with this episode. I like that they followed through with what they've been setting up all season. Jack's death wasn't a shocking twist--it was basically what a lot of fans had already guessed (particularly based on Randall saying he died when no one was looking). I loved Memphis, but I think this episode was just as heartbreaking, if not more so. In Memphis, William and Randall got to say goodbye, and the viewers got to see William reuniting with his mom. It was still heartbreaking, especially because Randall and William had such a short amount of time together, but at least the death itself was peaceful and done in a manner to provide both the character of Randall and viewers with closure. Tonight's episode felt more real to me. Obviously there were still plenty of dramatic moments, and Jack got to play the hero, but his death didn't have the same closure that William's did. His last words to Rebecca were a joke about her standing in front of the TV. We didn't get to see Jack's last moments like we did with William. None of the family, including Jack, knew it was coming, so there were no goodbyes. This makes sense given everything the show has built up around his death--how much it shocked and traumatized the whole family. It was probably tempting for the writers to throw in more satisfying closure and tearful goodbyes, but it would have been a cop-out. Yes, they still went over the top, and they continued to treat Jack like a saint, but at the same time, it makes perfect sense now why the whole family treats him like a saint. And yes, it was frustrating that he went back in for the video tapes and photos, but I didn't think that was unrealistic. If he saw a clear path out, I can buy him as someone who would think he's invincible. A lot of people wouldn't think to worry about damage from smoke inhalation. It's easy to look back and see what a bad idea it was, but I can see some people thinking it's worth it in the moment. I was surprised the family wasn't more concerned about Kevin. I know Rebecca knew he was staying at Sophie's, but if it were me, there would be this nagging fear that he had ended up coming home. I would have thought there would be more urgency to find him. I really liked Kevin's talks with Jack and Rebecca. I liked social worker Tess too. Part of me wondered if they introduced the future timeline to show Randall's death, since Randall there would be about the same age Jack was when he died. Plus Randall had that line last week about not being able to picture himself growing older than his dad. I really don't think they'll go there, though. I think it's more likely the flash forward was just a one off done to show the positive impact of fostering. I'm glad they finally revealed the mystery of Jack's death, and now I really want to see more of the aftermath in the months and years following. I wonder how much of this we'll get, since Jack is still a main character, so they'll need to continue devoting lots of screen time to flashbacks with him.
  3. Honestly, I haven't followed season 7 news very closely, so if the writers said Whook won't be getting a love interest, that's great news for you. I hope he gets to show more of a fun side some other way, then. I remember liking Hook as a character and enjoying his story even before he got together with Emma, so it would be nice if the writers used Whook as an opportunity to explore some of the non-Emma related things that made Hook a fun and compelling character. As it stands right now (from the limited bits of the season I've seen), there hasn't been much in the way of giving Whook characterization beyond his seach for his daughter. While I loved CS, because of all the obstacles they faced (particularly in the last two seasons), Hook tended to be kind of gloomy and grumpy, and we didn't always get to see his lighter side or his character development beyond his relationship with Emma, IMO.
  4. I wasn't specifically referring to your post, just to general concerns in the fandom about a possible romance between Whook and Rapunzel. My opinion is that, as much as I love CS, it could be fun seeing Whook and Rapunzel together (especially with the Tangled parallels...or rip-offs), and no, I don't believe it would taint CS in the slightest. I see your point regarding Whook's statement that he never found love, and I'm not saying Rapunzel and Whook will definitely end up falling for each other. But I also won't be surprised if they do--it wouldn't be the first time the writers contradicted something said in an earlier episode. It also wouldn't be the first time characters fall in love after one meeting. And like Curio said, it could also just be a case of them making a baby together but not falling in love. It doesn't really matter to me either way. I'm pretty sure there's nothing the reboot can do to get me invested, but it wouldn't hurt to inject a bit of fun and flirtiness from Hook. I didn't realize this would be such a hot button issue but I respect the passion for CS :)
  5. A New Beginning: OUAT 2.0

    I've barely watched this season. I have all the episodes recorded, and I've skimmed some of them, but this season seems like a bit of a chore to watch, which is sad considering how much I used to obsess over the show. I'm relieved that they gave Emma and Hook their happily ever after, but at the same time, it does make me feel much less invested in Whook's story. I like the idea of him having a daughter, but it isn't enough to hold my interest, considering this is a completely different character than the one I've been watching for six seasons. I almost wonder if it would have been better if they had found a way to separate Captain Swan for the season and then somehow show them being reunited in the finale. I get that this would have been difficult without a guaranteed appearance from Jmo in the finale, but I think they could've found a way around it. I still like the idea of some type of time travel, Fringe type final season where things go wrong in the premiere, and Hook spends the season trying to fix them and ends up going back in time and correcting that moment (so he is reunited with Emma in the finale). Then again, I would've been nervous that the writers would somehow mess it up and leave Captain Swan up in the air, so I think overall I'm good with how they handled it. But I can't stop wondering what casual viewers who missed episode 7×02 and/or the wishverse episode are thinking during Whook scenes. They must be so confused about why he suddenly has a daughter and why there's no mention of Emma. Also, I know there have been a lot of posts here trying to figure out the timeline, but what's the consensus on whether the show will clearly explain it at some point? Is there any hope that the timeline actually makes sense? Or are the writers going to ignore it completely and let it remain a total mess?
  6. I'm a huge Emma/Hook fan and I'm not very invested in Whook (or in this reboot--I've barely watched all season), but I kind of like the idea of Rapunzel and Whook together. It could be fun to see Hook in a different romance, maybe one that's a bit more flirtatious and fun, like the early days of CS. And I don't think it taints CS at all, considering Whook is a completely different character. If a real person can fall in love with different people throughout his/her lifetime, then surely a different version of a person can fall in love with someone else. Even Real Hook loved both Milah and Emma. I also like the idea of Whook having a daughter, and of this being his central, "true love" relationship. It's almost enough to motivate me to catch up on the episodes I've missed. Almost.
  7. I went back and looked at the announcement again and didn't see Moss anywhere. Maybe someone else caught it.
  8. I went back and watched Nicole Kidman's speech and didn't see any cuts to Elizabeth Moss. I also tried googling it, and the only thing that came up was an article in which Moss praises Kidman, calling her lovely and passionate, and talks about how excited she was to meet her on the set of a show they did together. If Moss has a problem with Kidman, I'm having trouble finding evidence. I'm really happy that the Handmaid's Tale was a big winner tonight. For me, it was one of those tv shows where you can't stop watching and then when you reach the end, you can't stop thinking about it. I'm a big fan of This is Us but I don't think it's as high calibre as some of the other nominees. I'm happy Sterling K. Brown won though, and I loved his speech.
  9. I really don't think Emma will be killed off. I could see why fans were starting to get worried during A & E's interviews from earlier in the summer when they were basically telling everyone to appreciate the happy endings and not let them be ruined by whatever happens next, but IMO, the more recent interviews make it pretty clear that Emma is not going to die and that CS will be fine in the end. A & E may be arrogant and they may be terrible interviewees, but I really doubt they would claim that Emma's ending is satisfying if she ends up dead--especially since they're well aware of how upset some fans already are at that prospect. More than that, they wouldn't go as far as saying "CS fans don't need to worry (but they do need to tune in)." I have very little faith in A & E, and I don't expect to find this season remotely satisfying, but I do expect that Emma and Hook will end up together (even if the reunion happens offscreen). I think fans have been so consistently let down by these writers that they sometimes actually start to see them as villains who are out to upset fans. Really, they're just average writers whose little bit of success went to their heads, but in the end they still badly want to appease their rabid fan base and just have no clue how to do that (and that's how we ended up with things like the Swan Queen friendship and the happy ending for Rumple and Belle). I still wonder if they might go with a Fringe type ending. Something terrible happens that results in all the separations (Emma and Hook; Henry and his daughter). We spend the season watching the heroes struggle to set things right. Then characters travel back in time to the moment things went wrong, but this time they go right and everyone carries on with their happy endings. I know JMO isn't coming back for the finale and Adam kind of shot down the idea that she had filmed any scene for the finale, but is it possible she filmed the same scene twice but with slightly different versions (one sad and one happy)? If not, I'm leaning more toward someone else's idea that they flash forward to Emma and Hook's reunion. That makes most sense given A & E's claims that episode 2 is both JMO's curtain call and a satisfying ending to her story.
  10. I just caught up after almost three weeks of being away from this forum and nope, there are still no spoilers to make me remotely interested in the new season. I don't think the writers will kill Emma or give Hook a new love interest (maybe his cursed persona but nothing lasting), but they're really doing a terrible job of allaying fan fears. In fact, it seems like they're going out of their way NOT to allay them, and I think the reason is because they're so in love with their #nospoilers policy that they can't see when it's doing more harm than good. At this point, it just makes them seem even more arrogant--like they're the most brilliant writers ever and their secrets must be protected at all costs. I want to like Adam and Eddy. I really do. But their comments--particularly Eddy's--just make them come across as smug, patronizing men speaking condescendingly to an audience they perceive as nothing more than idiot girls who just want to see Captain Swan kissing scenes. I mean okay, yes , I do want to see Captain Swan kissing scenes...but I would gladly trade those for some quality writing. It's amazing that a poorly written show about fairytales can cause so much frustration and disappointment. It makes me really sad to think that Emma's journey ended the way it did in the season 6 finale (and I doubt the season 7 episode will do anything to improve that ending). There was so much potential, and it is now officially squandered.
  11. I agree that this is more likely than Emma's death. But if this is what they're planning, I think they're making a big mistake by trying to keep it under wraps. I get that Adam and Eddy have an over the top aversion to spoilers--they seem to think their ideas are so clever that they must be protected at all costs--but them constantly dodging questions about whether Emma's happy ending will be destroyed does nothing but annoy or worry the fans they're counting on to tune in. They don't even have to outright say that Emma isn't dead (although I really don't think that's that big of a spoiler), but they could maybe try to be a little more optimistic in their responses instead of focusing all of their energy on trying so desperately to avoid spoiling their shocking! twists!
  12. How could the writers think this is a good idea? What makes them think fans will want to watch a redo of S1 without most of the main characters? Why did they decide to base this reboot on Henry of all characters? Ugh. I do like the idea of a cursed Hook, but that's not enough to hold my interest--especially without Emma. And filming spoilers just seem sad with most of the originals gone. Demolishing the cast and adding new characters this late in the game is such a mistake, IMO. I hope somehow all these changes energize everyone involved and the writers start writing for quality over shocking twists, but I doubt it. They didn't even care about writing for their main characters before, so I can't see them getting overly invested in these new characters. And even if they do, how will they get the audience invested? I suspect that the harder they try to make these characters seem dynamic and original, the more forced it's going to feel. From what I've heard, most fans aren't going into this season with optimism, so the only way to win them over is with quality writing and dynamic actors. I'll be pleasantly surprised if it happens.
  13. S01.E10: Chapter X

    I loved this show. I hadn't actually heard much about it before I started watching so I didn't know what to expect, but by the fourth or fifth episode I was hooked. I really liked almost all of the characters, and I appreciated how even when a character wasn't particularly likeable, they were still sympathetic or you could at least see where they were coming from. This is probably an unpopular opinion, but the one character I didn't like and had trouble sympathizing with was Gabe. I do think he's a realistic character--someone generally well intentioned but ignorant. My problem is that the way Gabe was portrayed, I think we were meant to take his side in a lot of issues, like when Sam didn't defend him to her friends in the first episode. Honestly, even though Reggie was being a jerk, I don't blame him for calling Gabe out on his ignorance. Same with Gabe calling the police. Sure, his intentions were good, but intentions don't always matter. I had moments of liking Gabe throughout, but by the end they were completely gone. I think I would've found him more sympathetic if we'd seen more of him acknowledging his own ignorance and admitting that he was wrong. Instead, we got more of Sam apologizing to him and then him being the one to break up with her. It just seemed to me like one of his main reasons for breaking up with Sam was essentially that her activism was inconvenient for him. He has a right to feel that way, but other people have a right to view him as a self-absorbed, privileged ass for it. And I certainly don't mean to defend Sam for cheating on him; if that were the main reason for the breakup then fair enough. Maybe my interpretation is off, but it really seemed to me like the writers were quite generous in how they wrote the character of Gabe. I initially thought he was going to turn out to be a jerk, especially after he posted the photo of Sam--I actually thought the relationship would be over then and there. Instead, the writers ended up trying to make him sympathetic, and it just didn't work for me. It almost seemed like a way to try to pacify white people who view this show as reverse racism--almost like Gabe was their way of saying "not all white people". Obviously YMMV, and I could be completely misinterpreting what the writers were going for. Maybe they simply were trying to show lots of different, complex perspectives, and that's a good thing. My issues with Gabe aside, I can't wait for season two.
  14. It's refreshing to hear an honest critique from someone involved in the show. Maybe Adam and Eddy are nice guys, but both seem too proud (or arrogant) to ever admit that they messed up a storyline. Whenever fans criticize them, I get the impression that A & E just dismiss them as crazy shippers who don't understand good writing. And their own belief in the genius of their writing is constantly reinforced by the actors praising them as master storytellers. I love that they're at least getting criticism from someone whom they likely highly respect. Maybe it isn't the most professional for Robert to complain about his bosses publicly (although I guess this wasn't really intended to be public), but at the same time, the criticism is completely justified. It must be so frustrating for the actors to see the drop in quality of writing over the years. I'm surprised that Eddy was so insistent on Golden Queen that he was willing to upset Robert--in what world was it worth it? That's one storyline where no matter how hard I squint, I cannot see one iota of appeal. I really have no idea what the writers were thinking there. I actually do think there's a difference between Adam and Eddy. Both come across as a bit arrogant, but I've always gotten the impression that Adam is the more passive one, and that he's also the one more afraid of upsetting fans. Eddy, on the other hand, I think is a little more arrogant, a little more condescending, and a little more insistent that his way is the best way. Maybe I'm completely off base, but I've had this impression for years, so Bobbie saying that it was Eddy he fought with really doesn't surprise me.
  15. The Writers of OUAT: Because, Um, Magic, That's Why

    I suspect Robin's death had a lot to do with fans' criticism that Regina and Emma were no longer strong female characters because of their love interests. I think the writers took this criticism to heart and decided to kill Robin and cut down on Captain Swan screentime. Normally I love it when shows focus more on familial relationships and friendships, but I thought it was handled really poorly here, particularly because limiting the romance didn't even serve to enhance the other relationships. Regina and Emma's friendship got a little more focus (unfortunately, IMO) but it wasn't well-written. And there was no extra time devoted to the familial relationships. So for me, cutting down on the love stories served absolutely no purpose. One of my biggest complaints about the last few seasons is that they set up big moments for Captain Swan and then chickened out when it came to paying them off. And as for Robin, I had two objections: 1) how weak the set-up was. If they knew they were going to kill him, why not give him more of a story ahead of time so that the death had more of an impact? 2) the way Sean was treated; I get that it's business and showrunners need to make tough decisions to try to do what's best for the show, but I think they could have handled this one so much better. It felt like Sean was thrown under the bus to appease some fans. Maybe I don't know the whole story and there were underlying issues with Sean, but to me it seemed like he was really enthusiastic about the show and got along great with the rest of the cast. So if they were really that set on getting rid of his character, why not do it in a way so that he could pop by from time to time? And if they really had to kill him, why obliterate his soul? That just seems a little too harsh. I also thought Neal's death was poorly handled (I'm forever bitter about the lost potential of the Bae/Rumple relationship), but his character at least got the hero treatment. Robin's death was discussed only in terms of Regina's pain. I don't miss the character of Robin and I actually like that Regina ended up single (for now), but I feel annoyed about the weak writing.